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Post by papresqr on Oct 10, 2013 11:09:57 GMT -5
We can file a union grievance...if there is anything specific in the contract that they are violating. The flexiplace contract does not address rescheduling of days, and there is nothing in writing about the practice in our office, although records will show that every writer has done so on every holiday. They could just say that they were not aware we were doing it and didn't authorize it.
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Post by christina on Oct 10, 2013 11:19:53 GMT -5
papresqr, are u NTEU or AFGE? If NTEU, get in touch with them. I think current manag. actions are consistent with AFGE contract so if you're in AFGE, options will be more limited.
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Post by papresqr on Oct 10, 2013 11:31:31 GMT -5
papresqr, are u NTEU or AFGE? If NTEU, get in touch with them. I think current manag. actions are consistent with AFGE contract so if you're in AFGE, options will be more limited. Unfortunately, I'm AFGE. For some reason, the AAs in my state are not part of NTEU, and AFGE is not exactly attorney friendly. Won't stop me from contacting them, but I don't hold out a lot of hope on that front.
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Post by bartleby on Oct 10, 2013 11:47:48 GMT -5
Grievance doesn't have to be filed by the Union, any employee can do it. You may or may not choose to have the union represent you. I have seen many successful grievances handled by individuals.
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Post by papresqr on Oct 10, 2013 11:54:18 GMT -5
Grievance doesn't have to be filed by the Union, any employee can do it. You may or may not choose to have the union represent you. I have seen many successful grievances handled by individuals. That's true, and I may go that route eventually, but will contact the Union first to see what they have to say.
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Post by tripper on Oct 10, 2013 12:21:48 GMT -5
We can file a union grievance...if there is anything specific in the contract that they are violating. The flexiplace contract does not address rescheduling of days, and there is nothing in writing about the practice in our office, although records will show that every writer has done so on every holiday. They could just say that they were not aware we were doing it and didn't authorize it. It's it policy that a manager has to check out the laptops and have a record of who took home was cases on which days? In which case it would be hard for them to say they were unaware that attorneys were switching days..
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Post by papresqr on Oct 10, 2013 12:48:13 GMT -5
We can file a union grievance...if there is anything specific in the contract that they are violating. The flexiplace contract does not address rescheduling of days, and there is nothing in writing about the practice in our office, although records will show that every writer has done so on every holiday. They could just say that they were not aware we were doing it and didn't authorize it. It's it policy that a manager has to check out the laptops and have a record of who took home was cases on which days? In which case it would be hard for them to say they were unaware that attorneys were switching days.. We keep the laptops, so they don't check them out to us each week. However, they do get our day cards with the cases we're taking home and the dates we are working from home. So yes, records will show that we were all doing it all along. Because we work an alternating schedule of 3 days on flexiplace one week and 2 the other, they would likely try to say they just assumed, without going back to look at the prior week, that it was our 3 day week on those holiday weeks that we worked at home Tues/Wed. I would counter that half of the writers would be there on those Wednesdays if that were the case, so it should have been obvious to them when none were there.
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Post by hopefalj on Oct 10, 2013 15:03:09 GMT -5
It's it policy that a manager has to check out the laptops and have a record of who took home was cases on which days? In which case it would be hard for them to say they were unaware that attorneys were switching days.. We keep the laptops, so they don't check them out to us each week. However, they do get our day cards with the cases we're taking home and the dates we are working from home. So yes, records will show that we were all doing it all along. Because we work an alternating schedule of 3 days on flexiplace one week and 2 the other, they would likely try to say they just assumed, without going back to look at the prior week, that it was our 3 day week on those holiday weeks that we worked at home Tues/Wed. I would counter that half of the writers would be there on those Wednesdays if that were the case, so it should have been obvious to them when none were there.     They're supposed to check your laptops every week to make sure you signed on at the time you've reported. I don't think any possible excuses would fly, but you never know. Admittedly, my mind is blown that you're AFGE and not NTEU. I assumed we were all NTEU. Also, I thought the AFGE contract allowed for three days of flexiplace every week. Guess not.
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Post by papresqr on Oct 10, 2013 15:48:28 GMT -5
Admittedly, my mind is blown that you're AFGE and not NTEU. I assumed we were all NTEU. Also, I thought the AFGE contract allowed for three days of flexiplace every week. Guess not. It does, but it only requires a minimum of one day a week. Our management decided to only allow 2 days on alternating weeks...for reasons that change every time we ask.
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Post by funkyodar on Oct 10, 2013 17:07:18 GMT -5
I'm AFGE as well. Our office allows flexi 3 days a week except on the last week of each month when we get no flexi at all.
A friend at our closest neighboring office gets just 2 days a week but every week.
Though our contract states that any flexi day that is taken by management should be made up even on "core" days that has never happened until this week. If we had to come in for training or whatever they have not once given us a makeup day. Now they give us tomorrow to make up for wed.
I assumed it was just a one time show of goodwill for morale. If so that has backfired. All the clerical staff that gets no flexi is now p.o.
I honestly think this boneheaded recall is going to plague morale for a long time. It could have been easily avoided by asking for volunteers or only recalling lead scts and seniors or doing some rotating furlough/excepted groups.
As I understand it, afge (who represents most of the field office folks and has never been overly helpful for attorneys) is one of the reasons for the recall. Representing angry FO personnel mad they were having to work and those in odar were furloughed and likely to be paid anyway, afge argued all should be treated equally. So we were brought back. Apparently without regard for whether we were really "essential" as defined by the antideficiency act.
If that's true, afge has lost my dues.
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Post by papresqr on Oct 10, 2013 17:36:51 GMT -5
I'm AFGE as well. Our office allows flexi 3 days a week except on the last week of each month when we get no flexi at all. A friend at our closest neighboring office gets just 2 days a week but every week. Though our contract states that any flexi day that is taken by management should be made up even on "core" days that has never happened until this week. If we had to come in for training or whatever they have not once given us a makeup day. Now they give us tomorrow to make up for wed. I assumed it was just a one time show of goodwill for morale. If so that has backfired. All the clerical staff that gets no flexi is now p.o. I honestly think this boneheaded recall is going to plague morale for a long time. It could have been easily avoided by asking for volunteers or only recalling lead scts and seniors or doing some rotating furlough/excepted groups. As I understand it, afge (who represents most of the field office folks and has never been overly helpful for attorneys) is one of the reasons for the recall. Representing angry FO personnel mad they were having to work and those in odar were furloughed and likely to be paid anyway, afge argued all should be treated equally. So we were brought back. Apparently without regard for whether we were really "essential" as defined by the antideficiency act. If that's true, afge has lost my dues. Mine as well, if so. While I can't blame the FO people for thinking it's not fair, there's nothing particularly fair about any of this. I'll bet they wouldn't have been crying foul if retroactive pay hadn't passed (and I know it hasn't, but it's expected to without problem) and they were eventually going to get paid and we weren't. As far as flexi days, we do get to take an alternate flexi day on Thursday or Friday when we have our quarterly training, which for some reason is always scheduled on a Wednesday, even though the supposed purpose of the "core" days is for training or meetings. I've just always found it incomprehensible that we all work for the same agency, same division if you will, and all have the same goals, but policies and procedures are entirely different from one office to another. If I worked for the office a half hour drive from mine, I'd be able to work from home 3 days every week. The next closest, it would only be 2 days a week.
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Post by JudgeRatty on Oct 10, 2013 19:26:19 GMT -5
I'm AFGE as well. Our office allows flexi 3 days a week except on the last week of each month when we get no flexi at all. A friend at our closest neighboring office gets just 2 days a week but every week. Though our contract states that any flexi day that is taken by management should be made up even on "core" days that has never happened until this week. If we had to come in for training or whatever they have not once given us a makeup day. Now they give us tomorrow to make up for wed. I assumed it was just a one time show of goodwill for morale. If so that has backfired. All the clerical staff that gets no flexi is now p.o. I honestly think this boneheaded recall is going to plague morale for a long time. It could have been easily avoided by asking for volunteers or only recalling lead scts and seniors or doing some rotating furlough/excepted groups. As I understand it, afge (who represents most of the field office folks and has never been overly helpful for attorneys) is one of the reasons for the recall. Representing angry FO personnel mad they were having to work and those in odar were furloughed and likely to be paid anyway, afge argued all should be treated equally. So we were brought back. Apparently without regard for whether we were really "essential" as defined by the antideficiency act. If that's true, afge has lost my dues. Mine as well, if so. While I can't blame the FO people for thinking it's not fair, there's nothing particularly fair about any of this. I'll bet they wouldn't have been crying foul if retroactive pay hadn't passed (and I know it hasn't, but it's expected to without problem) and they were eventually going to get paid and we weren't. As far as flexi days, we do get to take an alternate flexi day on Thursday or Friday when we have our quarterly training, which for some reason is always scheduled on a Wednesday, even though the supposed purpose of the "core" days is for training or meetings. I've just always found it incomprehensible that we all work for the same agency, same division if you will, and all have the same goals, but policies and procedures are entirely different from one office to another. If I worked for the office a half hour drive from mine, I'd be able to work from home 3 days every week. The next closest, it would only be 2 days a week. Amazing how different each ODAR office is regarding details like flexiplace and laptops. I get 2 days a week flexiplace and am NTEU. Every training I have been to is interesting when we all compare notes on the differences! You would think these details would be uniform but when there are different unions in play it complicates things. But even with the unions you would think there would only be two variations in flexiplace for writers. I assume the ALJ flexiplace is uniform in all offices?
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Post by chessparent on Oct 10, 2013 19:40:46 GMT -5
Ok, that's it-I know its dramatic, but I 'm using the frownie face now:
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Post by futuressaalj on Oct 10, 2013 20:24:40 GMT -5
Wow, this is an incredible thread. The OP was very happy to come to work and not sit home, even if their pay would be delayed some. Is it that folks want to sit at home and get paid? Cannot take leave or cannot flexiplace? We should be happy we have decent good paying jobs with weekends off and normal work hours. Perks such as Flexiplace are just that perks and not rights--even if they are in the contract.
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Post by eyre44 on Oct 10, 2013 21:09:28 GMT -5
Wow, this is an incredible thread. The OP was very happy to come to work and not sit home, even if their pay would be delayed some. Is it that folks want to sit at home and get paid? Cannot take leave or cannot flexiplace? We should be happy we have decent good paying jobs with weekends off and normal work hours. Perks such as Flexiplace are just that perks and not rights--even if they are in the contract. I've been biting my tongue, but I have to agree. I too wonder how much of this complaining would suddenly disappear if the furloughed employees were not going to get paid. I think suddenly it would be unfair, arbitrary, and grievable that the leads got to go in and the SCTs didn't. I will agree on the arbitrariness of flexiplace from office to office however. That's been a problem for a long time. The unions could fix this by changing future contracts to not allow any management perogative on the number flexiplace days absent some true and documented performance issues.
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Post by papresqr on Oct 10, 2013 21:49:34 GMT -5
Wow, this is an incredible thread. The OP was very happy to come to work and not sit home, even if their pay would be delayed some. Is it that folks want to sit at home and get paid? Cannot take leave or cannot flexiplace? We should be happy we have decent good paying jobs with weekends off and normal work hours. Perks such as Flexiplace are just that perks and not rights--even if they are in the contract. Yes, I'm happy I have a good job. However, SSA is not paying me out of the goodness of its heart (it's actually not paying me at all right now, but that's beside the point). They are paying me in return for my services. It's a 2 way street. If you want to call Flexiplace a perk rather than a right, that's fine. An argument could be made either way. But, regardless, perks are part of the overall compensation, just as stock options, company cars, expense accounts, etc. are part of compensation for some. I reserve the right to complain about, and maybe challenge, management practices that affect my compensation.
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Post by JudgeRatty on Oct 10, 2013 21:59:17 GMT -5
And MANY of us took this job because of those "perks" and even took a pay cut from prior jobs! Speaking for myself, the flexiplace is one of the most important "perks" that keeps me in this position. I also reserve the right to "whine" when I work hard in my job despite the current uncertainty of getting paid. I have not seen a single comment from anyone who thinks they would rather be sitting at home and getting paid. Those of us in this public service job do this work for many reasons, but we all know our mission is to serve the public. We are grateful to have jobs but that does not mean we have to yield to unjust or unfair practices.
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Post by funkyodar on Oct 10, 2013 22:54:29 GMT -5
I will reiterate my previous statements that I am glad to be back at work. In fact, if I had been given the option, I would have volunteered to work.
My issues are two fold, one personal and the other on behalf of fellow employees.
I'm a senior attorney. I like my job and am very grateful to have it and the perks. But beyond being an ssa employee, I am an attorney. One that was forced to sign a furlough document last week that explicitly advised that the performance of my job was nonessential and if I were to engage in doing my job I would be committing a crime under the antideficiency act. Now I am recalled and told to get back to doing my job. No one has provided any reasoning for why the job is now essential and I'm not committing the afore threatened crime. Unlike when I was kicked out of the building, I've been given no documentation on how I now meet the ADA's very clear definition of essential or any assurance that I'm protected from the ramifications of that law. Management merely forwarded a mass email that went out to everyone from the receptionists to the group supervisors that simply stated we were recalled. Theories abound (anger from the previously deemed essentials, work piled up, the proposed bill to pay furloughed workers that hasn't even passed the senate yet) but information on the real reason is so tightlipped that management can't even hold a meeting with us to give insight. Personally, I don't think expecting at least a few answers on the recall is too much to ask for an agency that so carefully documented sending me away.
That's the crux of my personal beef.
As to my problem with the way they have done it to others, its merely a sense of fairness. They didn't seem to have any qualms about telling the scts and others they weren't essential last week. And now they apparently have no concern for how these employees will pay for gas to get to work, childcare while they work or any other expenses that arise merely from coming to work without being paid. Sure they will eventually be paid. But daycare charges by the week and the exxon station here expects payment on receipt of fuel.
I work with a married couple. Neither are attorneys and they have 2 small children. Last week one was essential and the other furloughed. This being crapland, they live more than 40 miles from the office. Last week, the furloughed one could at least stay home and avoid the daycare bills. He was even able to get an outside activity approval and take on a freelance project to help make ends meet. This week he had to drop the outside project, join his wife on an 80+ mile roundtrip daily and put the kids back in daycare. All the while they have no income at present and were greeted with a cold email that seemed to imply if they had a child get sick and they missed work they would be AWOL and subject to disciplinary action.
Forgive me my sentimentality, but I just can't see the fairness in that.
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Post by prescient on Oct 10, 2013 23:40:02 GMT -5
Being forced to work without being paid is wrong. The fact that this could drag out for an indefinite period of time without any ability to take leave is horrendous.
Flexi is a part of this job without which many of us attorneys would not have chosen to accept the position. Nearly all of us took substantial pay cuts from private jobs to choose this position, which provides unmatched flexibility and low stress. Take away flexi, and you end up with the job being done by paralegals again and/or lower quality attorneys.
That said, I had no idea until today that some attorneys were in AFGE and that AFGE permits working up to 3 days at home. In our office, AFGE only gets 2 days, but changing the flexi days is permitted without question to accommodate holidays or personal need.
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Post by sealaw90 on Oct 11, 2013 10:50:51 GMT -5
Funny, attorneys are NTEU here in our Region 3 hamlet, and the "paralegals" are AFGE. They aren't allowed to change flexi days for holidays or work credit hours at home. We obviously can. I had no clue there were attys that weren't NTEU. Oh, and we only get two days at home, never Thursday or Friday. sbb - with a crappy flexiplace situation like that, I am begining to worry abut the only Region I want to work in. Sounds like there is distrust from management that you wouldn't really "work" if you worked from home on Th or Fr. I HATE that kind of attitutde!! When you say only two days, you mean 2 days per week, not per pay period, right?
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