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Post by workdrone on Jan 10, 2008 13:58:36 GMT -5
A while ago the SSA Comissioner mentioned an MSPB action pending against an ALJ with two federal jobs. Social Security News posted the details today. It seems the ALJ in question went public with his situation: socsecnews.blogspot.com/2008/01/alj-with-second-federal-job.html#linksIt seems like the ALJ in question was an Army Reserve JAG Colonel and the situation involves some real time keeping and flexiplace issues. I know we have a bunch of JAGs and former JAGs on this board. What do folks think?
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Post by Propmaster on Jan 10, 2008 16:09:58 GMT -5
How did he conduct hearings from Iraq?
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Post by aaa on Jan 10, 2008 17:05:42 GMT -5
And how did they email decisions to him? There was no OWA for SSA in 2005. And how did he review files while in Iraq?
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Post by yogibear on Jan 10, 2008 18:31:43 GMT -5
Just a note- The article said he was very productive, but 21 cases a month is less than 1/2 normal production and producing 771 cases over three years is just a bit over what's expected in one year.
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Post by southerner on Jan 10, 2008 18:50:56 GMT -5
Very bizarre.
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Post by bartleby on Dec 2, 2014 16:15:48 GMT -5
Hopealj, you noted: "Fraud? Threatening/harassing fellow employees? Violating federal law by double dipping and collecting your ALJ salary while receiving military pay? While I know the inevitable "But management was complicit!!!!" response is coming, that has very little effect on my feelings towards the judges removed. As an attorney (and hopefully judge one day), what others might let me get away with or even encourage should have no bearing on my ethical standards. Management's blind eye doesn't absolve a judge's improper or illegal conduct." Double dipping? The Judge in question was one of the best producers in his office during that time. Should he not be paid for his work according to his effort? What about all of the decisions he made during that time? Doesn't that count for something? He has a quantifiable work effort to support his pay. If anyone is upset, it should be the military, however, I understand he was given high ratings for his work there. If we have a Judge that can do 3500 casesa year, can not another Judge do 300-400 and do his military? The only time the Agency gets upset is when this stuff hits the papers. This is the type managment you will be working for. Further, as far as management, according to Agency definition, an outlier is someone with an 85% or higher pay rate and over 700 decisions for the year. Of those outliers, 40% of them are managment Judges. As some remind me all the time, we are not "real" Judges. I hate to shatter anyone's dreams, but, it is what it is.
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Post by hopefalj on Dec 2, 2014 18:05:55 GMT -5
Double dipping? The Judge in question was one of the best producers in his office during that time. Should he not be paid for his work according to his effort? What about all of the decisions he made during that time? Doesn't that count for something? He has a quantifiable work effort to support his pay. If anyone is upset, it should be the military, however, I understand he was given high ratings for his work there. If we have a Judge that can do 3500 casesa year, can not another Judge do 300-400 and do his military? It's not a question of whether he should be paid for work done. It's a question of whether he should have been doing his work as an ALJ while on active duty in the first place. The GAO has said no for decades prior to his activity in question. His production level or work ethic doesn't change that fact, yet it should be overlooked because he hit his numbers? I'm supposed to be shocked that openly violating federal personnel policy could lead to adverse employment issues? It's extremely difficult to get rid of federal employees, and removing an ALJ is no different. In fact, it may be more difficult. If newbies want a sure fire way to lose their jobs, do one of the following: break the law, falsify personnel documents (like time sheets, background forms, etc.), or be completely negligent in performing your job and violate agency policy. Not "or" violate agency policy. "And" violate it.
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Post by workdrone on Dec 2, 2014 19:51:15 GMT -5
Double dipping? The Judge in question was one of the best producers in his office during that time. Should he not be paid for his work according to his effort? What about all of the decisions he made during that time? Doesn't that count for something? He has a quantifiable work effort to support his pay. If anyone is upset, it should be the military, however, I understand he was given high ratings for his work there. If we have a Judge that can do 3500 casesa year, can not another Judge do 300-400 and do his military? It's not a question of whether he should be paid for work done. It's a question of whether he should have been doing his work as an ALJ while on active duty in the first place. The GAO has said no for decades prior to his activity in question. His production level or work ethic doesn't change that fact, yet it should be overlooked because he hit his numbers? I'm supposed to be shocked that openly violating federal personnel policy could lead to adverse employment issues? I agree with hopefalj. The real problem here isn't an issue of work performed or not. It's the violation of the Federal Dual Compensation Act at 5 U.S.C. 5534. The actual HHS DAB ALJ decision on this specific case is at: www.hhs.gov/dab/decisions/civildecisions/2009/CR1991.pdf. The HHS ALJ decision clearly lays out the legal and regulatory basis as to why this is against legal precedents going back to 1938. The moral here is that an ALJ still have to follow the same laws and regulations as everyone else. Please don't catch the black robe fever. In conclusion, if you don't want to lose your job and end up owing $427,784.00 to the United States plus interest, penalties and costs, don't do something this arrogant and stupid.
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Post by Deleted on Dec 3, 2014 0:24:15 GMT -5
Double dipping? The Judge in question was one of the best producers in his office during that time. Should he not be paid for his work according to his effort? What about all of the decisions he made during that time? Doesn't that count for something? He has a quantifiable work effort to support his pay. If anyone is upset, it should be the military, however, I understand he was given high ratings for his work there. If we have a Judge that can do 3500 casesa year, can not another Judge do 300-400 and do his military? It's not a question of whether he should be paid for work done. It's a question of whether he should have been doing his work as an ALJ while on active duty in the first place. The GAO has said no for decades prior to his activity in question. His production level or work ethic doesn't change that fact, yet it should be overlooked because he hit his numbers? I'm supposed to be shocked that openly violating federal personnel policy could lead to adverse employment issues? It's extremely difficult to get rid of federal employees, and removing an ALJ is no different. In fact, it may be more difficult. If newbies want a sure fire way to lose their jobs, do one of the following: break the law, falsify personnel documents (like time sheets, background forms, etc.), or be completely negligent in performing your job and violate agency policy. Not "or" violate agency policy. "And" violate it. Bartleby, the Judge in question knew he was wrong and continued to do it in spite of his wrong actions. I have not read one single MSPB decision removing an ALJ that didn't make sense to me. And no, none that I have read thus far have anything to do with the production goal. Beating their wife, hiring prostitutes, not showing up for work and blaming his wife for the three trillion gigabytes of porn downloaded on his office computer. Bartleby, you need to pick your battle a little better than the crook that was milking the Army and SSA for dual compensation in violation of Federal law, IMHO.
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Post by bartleby on Dec 3, 2014 9:22:50 GMT -5
Tigerlaw, the problem is is that the Judge produced work and should be paid for it. No one has ever questioned the quality of his work, I believe it is called quatum meruit. I think as an attorney you could make an arguement for this. The second big problem is that many people in management and time and attendance were fully aware of this and not only condoned it, but supported it by signing fraudulent time cards, etc. Nothing bad happened to them. No consequence. Does that tell you the true colors of those in charge?? You will be pressured to cut corners and once that slippery slope begins, it leads to very bad places. I am not supporting it, just asking for a broader swath of the brush of justice. Go after the big chesse as well as the small mouse..
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Post by Gaidin on Dec 3, 2014 9:32:18 GMT -5
Bart, I can't speak to what happened to the other folks involved but I am truly at a loss as to how you can justify this. The guy was robbing the American taxpayers. If the ALJ in question could meet the goal while also maintaining his military job then he could have been doing even more if he was only working as an ALJ. I assume that we take the ALJ job (or any job for that matter) to give it 100% not simply to meet the goal set by the employer.
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Post by moopigsdad on Dec 3, 2014 9:44:25 GMT -5
Tigerlaw, the problem is is that the Judge produced work and should be paid for it. No one has ever questioned the quality of his work, I believe it is called quatum meruit. I think as an attorney you could make an arguement for this. The second big problem is that many people in management and time and attendance were fully aware of this and not only condoned it, but supported it by signing fraudulent time cards, etc. Nothing bad happened to them. No consequence. Does that tell you the true colors of those in charge?? You will be pressured to cut corners and once that slippery slope begins, it leads to very bad places. I am not supporting it, just asking for a broader swath of the brush of justice. Go after the big chesse as well as the small mouse.. Bartleby, I do appreciate many of your posts on the Board and enjoy hearing about the kitties. However, here your stance in wrong. While, I don't condone that if others were complicit and involved in the cover-up they should get off scot-free, the ALJ had a duty to report he was performing more than one position or joh at a time. It didn't matter if he performed the work and did it admirably, the point is that he did it in violation of federal law. Should the others hsve suffered consequences, of course, but don't excuse the ALJ because he was able to perform each job. Gaidin is right, just think what he could have accomplished if he were truly working one job at a time. I am not trying to beat up on you, I am only trying to reason with you. Under your theory could not the bank robber argue for a Quantum Meruit claim for his planning and attempt efforts in trying to rob a bank, even if he was caught and convicted prior to gaining any access to the money from the bank. Two wrongs, don't make a right Bartleby.
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Post by bartleby on Dec 3, 2014 11:21:13 GMT -5
I don't think you all are understanding my position. His management were totally aware of it. They may have even encouraged it. They certainly condoned it. The numbers were more important then the ethics to the management. This goes so far as Regional management. I can't beleive that you all aren't questioning why heads didn't roll. Many of these same people you may end up working for or under. Do you really feel comfortable with that? This guy can claim he did it for the good of the cause and no harm was commited. This and West Virginia fully illustrate the quality of management and the emphasis of the Agency. By shooting the Judge that in reality did his job end the problem with the Agency? I think not. You seem to think that this job is some sort of Supreme Court Justice position where no dark thoughts can be considered/tolerated. Let em tell you what, you are nothing more than an employee. And some in management have no second thoughts about asking you to cross that line in the sand to move a few more cases.. I am surprised that no one is rightously indignant that the people in charge and in the know weren't thrown under the bus with the culprit.. Strange.
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Post by luckylady2 on Dec 3, 2014 11:27:24 GMT -5
Yeah, and then there's the pesky issue of public trust and ethics and all.
As a former prosecutor friend of mine used to say - it all comes down to lyin', cheatin', and stealin'. It appears from the evidence that the former ALJ in question did all 3. No doubt he should have been removed and prosecuted.
The aiders and abetters are always stickier, aren't they? Bart's right that they also violated the public trust, and at the very least did some lyin'.
At one point I was transitioning between two federal agencies and took leave-without-pay from one whenever I needed to put in some hours for the other - of course with all the requisite permissions from the superiors in both agencies. It generated a prolific paper trail, but the time and work were clearly allocated. I never spent an hour in service of both agencies at the same time, and I was never paid twice for the same hour by two agencies, unlike the disgraced ALJ in question.
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Post by Gaidin on Dec 3, 2014 11:56:01 GMT -5
Bart if you want us to be concerned or outraged that people allowed this ALJ to get away with this fraud is fine. However, the ALJ isn't a victim and trying to paint them as one (which is how most of us are reading your posts) isn't going to work.
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Post by bartleby on Dec 3, 2014 12:21:52 GMT -5
I agree, but you do understand that he did both jobs satisfactorily don't you? I personally think he was encouraged by management. Should he lose his pay and his 401K due to this? What about the hardship on his family. This is an extreme example, but management will put you in similiar situations, if no more than hearing a case at the last minute without preparing for it. I am just saying, you might look back some day and say, holy crap, how did I get into this situation. Oh. and when it goes down, nobody in management knows anything..
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Post by Ace Midnight on Dec 3, 2014 12:31:25 GMT -5
the crook that was milking the Army and SSA for dual compensation in violation of Federal law, IMHO. The thing is - no segment of our society is more trusted or revered than the U.S. military. Not the clergy, not the elected officials, not the police or firefighters (although those cats are close) - it does not take very much to lose that hard-earned trust. Situations like this definitely cause eyebrows to raise. And I would have been willing to do either job, to the exclusion of everything else - that gets me on a personal level. (And I don't care how many cases he was cranking out - I find myself with conflicting priorties with a reserve gig and a day job - I can only imagine if the military gig was full-time - theoretically 24 hours a day, 7 days a week during a crisis.)
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Post by bartleby on Dec 3, 2014 12:46:09 GMT -5
I agree, and I understand where most of you are coming from. I just think some of you have misconceived what this job/title really is.. Good luck to you all.
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Post by moopigsdad on Dec 3, 2014 13:21:04 GMT -5
I agree, and I understand where most of you are coming from. I just think some of you have misconceived what this job/title really is.. Good luck to you all. Bartleby I am appreciative of your efforts to point out the problems new ALJs might face one day. I only wished the example you chose to hang your hat on was a slightly better one in my opinion. Thanks again Bart for the "heads-up".
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Post by sealaw90 on Dec 3, 2014 13:31:02 GMT -5
I agree, but you do understand that he did both jobs satisfactorily don't you? I personally think he was encouraged by management. Should he lose his pay and his 401K due to this? What about the hardship on his family. This is an extreme example, but management will put you in similiar situations, if no more than hearing a case at the last minute without preparing for it. I am just saying, you might look back some day and say, holy crap, how did I get into this situation. Oh. and when it goes down, nobody in management knows anything.. The analogy I envision throughout this example of (yet) another ALJ who blatantly violated the rules while management sat by is the one where the 15 year old gangsta wanna-be refuses to accept responsibility for pulling the trigger and killing some random person on the street. After all, he wanted to be a part of this gang so badly, he HAD to kill someone as part of being in the gang, his future gang members told him they'd be there for him and vouch for him, they even got him the gun to use and showed him how to pull the trigger. Do you think I am shocked and surprised when only the 15 year old goes to jail for murder because the rest of the rats left the sinking ship? Do you think his defense regarding his accomplices' actions leading up to the crime really mitigated his sentence? So, should I be upset that there is a society out there that allows/encourages/condones bad behavior among otherwise law abiding citizens? Sure. Why is everyone mad at this guy on this board? Because this ALJ is a freakin' lawyer - a member of the bar - an ALJ - and is supposed to do the right thing EVEN WHEN NO ONE IS LOOKING! Perhaps some of the wannabes are excited by the prospect that they might find a boss who is complicit in their shenanigans, perhaps some will be outraged. I am glad Bartleby is mad that management isn't getting punished for this, it is outrageous. Perhaps a well-placed complaint to the Office of Special Council is in order. But I think the only thing folks can control right now is their own behavior. Until they are in an office and personally witness illegal/unethical behavior, then they can make the call - complain or be complicit.
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