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Post by sealaw90 on Nov 4, 2014 13:18:35 GMT -5
Just a little friendly advice...take the ranking/striking of cities very seriously. It certainly appears that all the doomsaying prognosticators that forewarned a significnatly curtailed transfer outlook were right. Requests for transfers are (and admittedly always have been) "frozen" for any city for which a cert has been requested. In the past, when the cert to hire process was quicker and when certs expired pretty quickly after the end of a round of hiring, that wasnt such a big deal. Now it is huge. Those wanting transfer to one of the 28 cities now certed are pretty much out in the cold for a long time. Not only is it taking much longer for opm to return cert requests meaning a longer "frozen" period for those cities than usual, but there is good intel that the third and maybe even subsequent hiring rounds will come from this cert as well. Meaning even after the second group is hired in December the cert cities will remain frozen until third and maybe fourth rounds are done sometime in the future. Moral of the story: Choose wisely. You cannot depend on the "take anywhere and transfer later" mentality of old. Where ever you land may well end up being your home for a good long while. I love this part: "there is good intel that the third and maybe even subsequent hiring rounds will come from this cert as well." Very good to hear. As long as they add more cities for the third and forth rounds, then it is good to hear!!!
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Post by JudgeRatty on Nov 4, 2014 13:23:38 GMT -5
I love this part: "there is good intel that the third and maybe even subsequent hiring rounds will come from this cert as well." Very good to hear. As long as they add more cities for the third and forth rounds, then it is good to hear!!! I have no doubt we will see more cities as we plug along! Here is hoping yours is on the next round!
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Post by JudgeRatty on Nov 4, 2014 14:16:54 GMT -5
Just a little friendly advice...take the ranking/striking of cities very seriously. It certainly appears that all the doomsaying prognosticators that forewarned a significnatly curtailed transfer outlook were right. Requests for transfers are (and admittedly always have been) "frozen" for any city for which a cert has been requested. In the past, when the cert to hire process was quicker and when certs expired pretty quickly after the end of a round of hiring, that wasnt such a big deal. Now it is huge. Those wanting transfer to one of the 28 cities now certed are pretty much out in the cold for a long time. Not only is it taking much longer for opm to return cert requests meaning a longer "frozen" period for those cities than usual, but there is good intel that the third and maybe even subsequent hiring rounds will come from this cert as well. Meaning even after the second group is hired in December the cert cities will remain frozen until third and maybe fourth rounds are done sometime in the future. Moral of the story: Choose wisely. You cannot depend on the "take anywhere and transfer later" mentality of old. Where ever you land may well end up being your home for a good long while.I think Funky is onto something here. Make sure you don't assume you will get a transfer quickly as it has happened for some in the past. Think very carefully... can you live in a city with no metropolis, no readily available alcohol (at least one of these cities is a limited dry county meaning no sale of alcohol unless in a restaurant with more than 100 seats), no bus system, no bike lanes? Think long and hard before sending that list to Bob.
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Post by WhereIsTheFrontDoor on Nov 4, 2014 14:30:21 GMT -5
So does that mean Orlando is really in play? I'm an outsider and just assumed a transfer would end up claiming that spot. Interesting to learn cities are frozen when a cert has been requested.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2014 14:40:41 GMT -5
I heard Middlesboro, KY was the party capital of KY. Free refills in every bar in town! Go Middlesboro!
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Post by JudgeRatty on Nov 4, 2014 14:46:42 GMT -5
I heard Middlesboro, KY was the party capital of KY. Free refills in every bar in town! Go Middlesboro! Does "bar" mean back porch and the family still? LOL! I have several cousins in that area.... so I know how "remote" it can be. LOL!
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Post by spousemouse on Nov 4, 2014 20:59:24 GMT -5
Just a little friendly advice...take the ranking/striking of cities very seriously. It certainly appears that all the doomsaying prognosticators that forewarned a significnatly curtailed transfer outlook were right. Requests for transfers are (and admittedly always have been) "frozen" for any city for which a cert has been requested. In the past, when the cert to hire process was quicker and when certs expired pretty quickly after the end of a round of hiring, that wasnt such a big deal. Now it is huge. Those wanting transfer to one of the 28 cities now certed are pretty much out in the cold for a long time. Not only is it taking much longer for opm to return cert requests meaning a longer "frozen" period for those cities than usual, but there is good intel that the third and maybe even subsequent hiring rounds will come from this cert as well. Meaning even after the second group is hired in December the cert cities will remain frozen until third and maybe fourth rounds are done sometime in the future. Moral of the story: Choose wisely. You cannot depend on the "take anywhere and transfer later" mentality of old. Where ever you land may well end up being your home for a good long while. Are we absolutely sure of this? I know a judge who transferred to a first cert city after the first cert was issued. The transfer process is governed in part by a union contract with the judges, so "changes" have to be within its bounds.
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Post by funkyodar on Nov 4, 2014 21:12:30 GMT -5
I'm only reporting what the dcalj told the first cert class.
I was also forwarded an email chain where someone was questioning why they didnt get a transfer instead of one of us newbies landing where the hopeful transferee wanted. The union and agency response was that transfers are frozen in regard to cities on a cert and that opm's recent foot dragging doesnt change that. In short, if there is an active cert for a city, to get into that city via transfer one's request must predate the cert request for that city.
All us first cert hires that wanted to transfer to any of these second cert cities aren't even eligible to ask yet. And from all appearances we will be SOL for some time. In regard to these cities, anyway.
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Post by Who Me? on Nov 4, 2014 21:17:36 GMT -5
From what I understand, you can't request a transfer until you have served at least 90 days at your first post. Even then, my guess is that as the new kid on the block you'll be at the bottom of the transfer list for that city.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2014 21:30:59 GMT -5
I'm responding for two reasons, one I think my status changes at 200 posts and I become a legend in my own mind AGAIN!
Two, a lot of ALJs sit on the 5 cities that they would "like" to retire, divorce and move to, live in after the kids get out of school or whatever, but just hold a place on that city's xfer list. I know one ALJ that got her city when she was 7 or 8 on the list and a friend of hers got her city at number 12, so yes it starts at 90 days, but being 5, 10 or so on the list may not be the end of the world as the other ALJs in front of you may not be ready to move and just decline and hold their spot on the list.
Post 194 and counting!!!
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Post by funkyodar on Nov 4, 2014 21:33:13 GMT -5
Right on the 90 days.
Placement on the list is highly dependent on the city.
But if you are wanting a city for which an active cert exists, unless your request to transfer predates the cert request, you are SOL. Till the cert expires. Per what we were told at training anyway.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2014 21:33:33 GMT -5
I'm only reporting what the dcalj told the first cert class. I was also forwarded an email chain where someone was questioning why they didnt get a transfer instead of one of us newbies landing where the hopeful transferee wanted. The union and agency response was that transfers are frozen in regard to cities on a cert and that opm's recent foot dragging doesnt change that. In short, if there is an active cert for a city, to get into that city via transfer one's request must predate the cert request for that city. All us first cert hires that wanted to transfer to any of these second cert cities aren't even eligible to ask yet. And from all appearances we will be SOL for some time. In regard to these cities, anyway. Great point Funky!!! 195 and counting!
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2014 21:36:05 GMT -5
Speaking of ranking cities, anybody have a question about Tupelo, MS???
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Post by Who Me? on Nov 4, 2014 21:38:50 GMT -5
I'm responding for two reasons, one I think my status changes at 200 posts and I become a legend in my own mind AGAIN! Two, a lot of ALJs sit on the 5 cities that they would "like" to retire, divorce and move to, live in after the kids get out of school or whatever, but just hold a place on that city's xfer list. I know one ALJ that got her city when she was 7 or 8 on the list and a friend of hers got her city at number 12, so yes it starts at 90 days, but being 5, 10 or so on the list may not be the end of the world as the other ALJs in front of you may not be ready to move and just decline and hold their spot on the list. Post 194 and counting!!! Good point, Tiger. So there is hope for a newbie ALJ to get to a preferable location before some of the more seasoned ALJs. Of course, another option is to apply for a posted opening with another agency, since one of the requirements is to be a current or former federal ALJ.
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Post by Gaidin on Nov 4, 2014 21:40:22 GMT -5
From what I understand, you can't request a transfer until you have served at least 90 days at your first post. Even then, my guess is that as the new kid on the block you'll be at the bottom of the transfer list for that city. Who there are extensive discussions in other threads about how the contract controls the transfer process. There are even some threads from earlier this year with the transfer list in a spreadsheet and endless speculation about what it all means. There is some new info in what Funky said. The contract requires that the agency work the transfer list before hiring but that doesn't mean that the transfer takes place before hiring. If I recall correctly the ALJ has some time between a accepting the transfer and physically moving. All that being said newbies should dig into the search function. Not only are lots of questions already answered. Questions you didn't know to ask are answered.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2014 21:46:09 GMT -5
I'm responding for two reasons, one I think my status changes at 200 posts and I become a legend in my own mind AGAIN! Two, a lot of ALJs sit on the 5 cities that they would "like" to retire, divorce and move to, live in after the kids get out of school or whatever, but just hold a place on that city's xfer list. I know one ALJ that got her city when she was 7 or 8 on the list and a friend of hers got her city at number 12, so yes it starts at 90 days, but being 5, 10 or so on the list may not be the end of the world as the other ALJs in front of you may not be ready to move and just decline and hold their spot on the list. Post 194 and counting!!! Good point, Tiger. So there is hope for a newbie ALJ to get to a preferable location before some of the more seasoned ALJs. Of course, another option is to apply for a posted opening with another agency, since one of the requirements is to be a current or former federal ALJ. As a NODAR, I'm an outsider on a lot of these things, but I hear it is real hard on the transferring to another agency, I got OMHA offer and ODAR, but OMHA seems real comfortable with ODAR ALJ and OMHA has a great Deputy Chief by the name of "Skip" Moore, just a great guy to talk with about his agency.
Somebody reported earlier on the boards about some of his friends trying to transfer between agencies have been trying for years to do so, my advice is be happy with your choice because you will be there for awhile as far as agency and city.
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Post by Who Me? on Nov 4, 2014 21:51:49 GMT -5
Thanks, Gaidin. Wish I had endless amounts of time to search through the forum for all the questions I, or other newer members, might have. However, that's not the case.
From my relative short time here as a member and some time lurking, I have sensed that most of the members, including legends, are happy to share info even though it's been posted before. Isn't that one of the purposes of a forum?
If I ever reach "Legend" status, I certainly will be glad to share my knowledge and information, regardless of how many posts previously addressed that subject/issue. I think the concept is called mentoring.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2014 22:00:37 GMT -5
From what I understand, you can't request a transfer until you have served at least 90 days at your first post. Even then, my guess is that as the new kid on the block you'll be at the bottom of the transfer list for that city. Who there are extensive discussions in other threads about how the contract controls the transfer process. There are even some threads from earlier this year with the transfer list in a spreadsheet and endless speculation about what it all means. There is some new info in what Funky said. The contract requires that the agency work the transfer list before hiring but that doesn't mean that the transfer takes place before hiring. If I recall correctly the ALJ has some time between a accepting the transfer and physically moving. All that being said newbies should dig into the search function. Not only are lots of questions already answered. Questions you didn't know to ask are answered. Excellent point Gaidin, if you have the time, the old posts are worth their weight in gold. Please ignore that "other" tigerlaw dude, he was a crazy dude that hacked my online identity and even got me suspended for a week or so. But other than that, old posts have a ton of info.
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Post by Who Me? on Nov 4, 2014 22:01:31 GMT -5
As a NODAR, I'm an outsider on a lot of these things, but I hear it is real hard on the transferring to another agency, I got OMHA offer and ODAR, but OMHA seems real comfortable with ODAR ALJ and OMHA has a great Deputy Chief by the name of "Skip" Moore, just a great guy to talk with about his agency.
Somebody reported earlier on the boards about some of his friends trying to transfer between agencies have been trying for years to do so, my advice is be happy with your choice because you will be there for awhile as far as agency and city. I confess ignorance if "immigration judge" qualifies as a current or former ALJ.
Tiger: You may be right, but I have seen the backgrounds of ALJs at other agencies, the vast majority, if not all, got their start at ODAR. Since ODAR is the largest fed ALJ employer, it would seem that you can't get to another fed agency unless you started at ODAR. Every recruitment for other fed agencies I've seen requires the applicant be a current or former fed ALJ. Since they won't hire off OPM's register, the logical conclusion is you must work for ODAR or OMHA. Yes, it may take years to transfer to another agency. But, depending on their needs, it's still a possibility.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 4, 2014 22:12:25 GMT -5
I agree that ODAR is the best place to start. And we all do what is best for our own needs and it's a real possibility.
I'm just saying that you should go into accepting ODAR as your first, last and only agency and you can not be disappointed with your decision.
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