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Post by Propmaster on Jun 5, 2015 17:11:48 GMT -5
I was tempted to add a post to another topic in which I took a person's negative comment and ran with it, adding my own story of woe (words of advice I learned many years ago (and that I still wonder if I am 'learning' from): don't have a nasty, in-person argument with the Chief ALJ of SSA 2 weeks before hiring starts, even if you are defending honor and righteousness). I did not want to hijack another thread, though. So I thought never mind...
But, I am consistently drawn to wallowing in self-pity during this process. The hiring right now is 40% in cities on my GAL and the sweet spot of the NOR poll is right over my score. When I initially applied to be an ALJ, I did not work at SSA. Once I began working here, I saw that my wildest imaginings about the ridiculous inefficiencies of the agency and about the breadth of its accomplishments were both insufficient in magnitude compared to the truth. I have learned a lot. And I am 100% confident I could do the job (not necessarily 'better' than the others on this list, but I am qualified).
I was three struck before (my name was omitted from the later certs on the last register), and I was not going to reapply (because I think the striking was related to the expression of ethical priciples out loud, on which the agency frowns), but I did so to honor the wishes of my father, who maintains enough optimism for both of us. And now I sit, happy for those of you who have been selected (but also, slightly envious), and knowing there are about four three offices to fill in my ODAR and I am unlikely to have one.
After some recent hires, I simply checked out of the board for a while. That's not so practical when things are happening so fast. Several years ago, I made a thread similar to this during a hiring. Some found it cathertic to be negative and to realize that there are other people thinking negative thoughts during this process. You can say the thing you think you are not supposed to say, maybe feel better, and move forward.
This is not the approach that is right for everyone. This thread will attract comments from people urging one to keep up one's hopes, that it's a long process (and there may even be people from the OLD (pre-Internet) register out here waiting), etc. There is a place for that optimism. We who post in this thread need to get over our negative thoughts and keep open to the possibilities of life, etc.
But, first, like a pig wallowing in mud to cool off, I want to spend a while wallowing in negativity to prepare for that optimistic shake-off and then a return to normalcy. And I want other people to know that sullen, wise (?) forum legend Propmaster gives you permission to sulk with me. For a while.
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Post by funkyodar on Jun 5, 2015 17:37:21 GMT -5
Wise beyond your years prop.
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Post by sealaw90 on Jun 5, 2015 18:09:28 GMT -5
While I am not ready to actually wallow, there is a sense of frustration when none of my cities get a certificate. I try to stay happy for everyone who is up for a position because they made the cert and have interviewed, but since this is the thread for self pity, I understand your need to get the negative thoughts out in public and then move on. My negativity revolves around a personal situation that forced me to stay local. Even if we can expand our GAL I might be able to add a half dozen cities. Things will be brighter in 2 years, so I guess I am at the midway point. It really sucks. To add more self pity to the equation, my cities are actually in crapland, but apparently no one really leaves these places, so I don't even get a chance to interview with ODAR!!! Wow, you were right Prop, it feels good to get this out in the open. Now I can go back to waiting for my turn, whenever that may be.
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Post by berk727 on Jun 6, 2015 10:26:53 GMT -5
I'm all for wallowing! I have a wide open GAL (every single city) the scores have gotten below mine consistently, and my number one choice is the crappiest of crapland, according to everyone here (it's the city often used to define crapland.) I clearly have been passed over a bunch of times, since I'm on every cert for every city. I was on the November certs then this one. so I feel pretty much done at this time. I await with hope the surge of optimism and return to normalcy. Thanks propmaster for starting this thread!!
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Post by zepplin on Jun 6, 2015 10:29:27 GMT -5
Same here Berk.
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Post by 71stretch on Jun 6, 2015 11:11:56 GMT -5
My wise old friend propmaster has said it well. I am in a very different place about this process than I was five years ago, which is a good thing. I am, however, looking forward to the next set of certs to see if it will be 2012 revisited, and many are left off certs they would otherwise be on. I remember what a punch in the stomach that was. But, that was then, this is now.
They might wait a little longer to do that -- we will see.
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Post by saaao on Jun 6, 2015 12:42:52 GMT -5
I started to post here to join in the wallowing. I have been on every cert since the first one. I am not completely wide open but I have always been available for plenty of cities and have definitely made top three several times at least. I am a ten point veteran and my resume should objectively make me somebody they want. Yet they have passed on my every time. It has been professionally demoralizing and from a practical perspective extremely disruptive to my personal life.
However as I was thinking over all the objective reasons why they should have called me by now I reminded myself that I am already in a very good place professionally and though my home is far away from where I currently live, the city I am in is pretty nice, even if it is not where I really wanted to end up permanently. While I know not everyone is in this position, getting ALJ will not represent a significant raise for me, and in my current position I don't have to have hearings where I get to have an aggressive Meth Addict try and convince me why he should be given disability benefits for the lingering effects of the toe he stubbed back in 1988.
While I do want this job, I think I have fallen into the sunk cost trap of thinking that this will validate me professionally, in a way I am not already and I will move someplace where all the hassles of where I currently live will magically disappear. The reality is that I am pretty much professionally validated as I ever will be, even if I got the city I most want all the hassles of where I live will just be replaced with other equally annoying hassles of a different stripe. And lets not forget and the subject matter an ODAR ALJ puts up with is for the most part extremely unpleasant from a factual perspective, while being extremely bland from a legal perspective. No one will ever pen a thrilling legal drama about a disability case.
I am waiting for the last of my cities from this round to disappear from the poll. Then I am going to book a vacation somewhere nice and have an incredible time not worrying a bit with what is going on with this process. When I return, if I am on the next round of certs I will return my list...if there are any cities I think look really interesting.
Sorry I know this was not the purpose of this thread, but I do feel better.
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Post by aljhopeful2 on Jun 6, 2015 13:59:49 GMT -5
I'm all for wallowing! I have a wide open GAL (every single city) the scores have gotten below mine consistently, and my number one choice is the crappiest of crapland, according to everyone here (it's the city often used to define crapland.) I clearly have been passed over a bunch of times, since I'm on every cert for every city. I was on the November certs then this one. so I feel pretty much done at this time. I await with hope the surge of optimism and return to normalcy. Thanks propmaster for starting this thread!! I hear you, man! Feel like I'm in the same boat.
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Post by moopigsdad on Jun 6, 2015 17:01:33 GMT -5
Berk727 and Zepplin I am with 71stretch here. While, I do understand the pain and anguish, it isn't over until you stop making certs. Remember, at some point, SSA will have to choose from some of those candidates SSA previously passed over because there will be no other choice for them. Keep the faith until you get that punch in the gut as 71stretch said.
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Post by Gaidin on Jun 8, 2015 10:13:32 GMT -5
I think what all of you folks in this thread really want is a little respect. Watch the little girl in the middle she is gold from beginning to end.
Well crud. I can't get the video to post. I will try to find it.
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Post by gary on Jun 8, 2015 10:18:16 GMT -5
I think what all of you folks in this thread really want is a little respect. Watch the little girl in the middle she is gold from beginning to end. Well crud. I can't get the video to post. I will try to find it. Woe is me! I can't even watch the self-pity video!
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Post by moopigsdad on Jun 8, 2015 10:24:37 GMT -5
I think what all of you folks in this thread really want is a little respect. Watch the little girl in the middle she is gold from beginning to end. Well crud. I can't get the video to post. I will try to find it. Woe is me! I can't even watch the self-pity video! Thanks for my laugh of the day Gary!!! Triple-like the comment.
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donk
Full Member
Posts: 42
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Post by donk on Jun 8, 2015 10:43:42 GMT -5
I am thinking either a reference did me in or I am a terrible interviewee! Oh well, life goes on... glad for this thread. Much needed catharsis.
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Post by ibnlurkin on Jun 8, 2015 10:55:43 GMT -5
for me I'm thinking it must be the comb over !
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Post by Propmaster on Jun 8, 2015 11:18:06 GMT -5
{I}t isn't over until ... SSA {gives} you {a} punch in the gut ... With creative editing, this comment is hilarious to me. What a synopsis of the process.
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Post by Propmaster on Jun 8, 2015 11:27:59 GMT -5
I started to post here to join in the wallowing. I have been on every cert since the first one. I am not completely wide open but I have always been available for plenty of cities and have definitely made top three several times at least. I am a ten point veteran and my resume should objectively make me somebody they want. Yet they have passed on my every time. It has been professionally demoralizing and from a practical perspective extremely disruptive to my personal life. However as I was thinking over all the objective reasons why they should have called me by now I reminded myself that I am already in a very good place professionally and though my home is far away from where I currently live, the city I am in is pretty nice, even if it is not where I really wanted to end up permanently. While I know not everyone is in this position, getting ALJ will not represent a significant raise for me, and in my current position I don't have to have hearings where I get to have an aggressive Meth Addict try and convince me why he should be given disability benefits for the lingering effects of the toe he stubbed back in 1988. While I do want this job, I think I have fallen into the sunk cost trap of thinking that this will validate me professionally, in a way I am not already and I will move someplace where all the hassles of where I currently live will magically disappear. The reality is that I am pretty much professionally validated as I ever will be, even if I got the city I most want all the hassles of where I live will just be replaced with other equally annoying hassles of a different stripe. And lets not forget and the subject matter an ODAR ALJ puts up with is for the most part extremely unpleasant from a factual perspective, while being extremely bland from a legal perspective. No one will ever pen a thrilling legal drama about a disability case. I am waiting for the last of my cities from this round to disappear from the poll. Then I am going to book a vacation somewhere nice and have an incredible time not worrying a bit with what is going on with this process. When I return, if I am on the next round of certs I will return my list...if there are any cities I think look really interesting. Sorry I know this was not the purpose of this thread, but I do feel better. I disagree, I think this post fulfilled the purpose of the thread. Relieve the pressure on your chest - if you feel better while typing, so much the healthier for you. I have many years until I retire. I am a subject matter expert, and I do not relish learning a new area of law. I disagree the law is bland here, but I agree it is often applied that way because of all the constraints. However, I prefer to have a grasp on even a small, bland area of law and to practice within that area than to flounder in an uncertain pool of law. I don't want to start over. Barring ALJ appointment, I am at the highest possible level I can achieve within my self-imposed criteria (good benefits, no clients, doing SSA law, not management). So, as pathetic as it may be (and it is), SSA ALJ repersents the pinnacle of my ambition. {ugh}. I used to like my job, until one middle management official in Huntington, WV, failed to do his job to document his administrative actions, and ODAR imploded nationally. Now I like my job better than anything else I might be doing, but still very little in the absolute sense. So.... Hmmm.... No point here, really. Just continuing to vent. I guess I'm not out of the muck yet.
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Post by Propmaster on Jun 8, 2015 11:46:50 GMT -5
I think what all of you folks in this thread really want is a little respect. Watch the little girl in the middle she is gold from beginning to end. Well crud. I can't get the video to post. I will try to find it. Obviously, I haven't seen the video, but that's an interesting point. I wonder to what extent the process just makes one feel disrespected? We don't get to know our score on individual pieces, for the most part. We don't get a time table. We don't get timely informed when we're not chosen. Assuming it is legal (and it is) to "3 strike" someone, there seems to be no real reason to keep it secret except to avoid litigation. On the other hand, some of us spend years and money persuing the process again, when they could make life easier by just saying, "look, we're not going to hire you." I've had really harsh disappointment in my life (ooooh, flashbacks - shiver), and I got past it (except those flashbacks), but could it be a lack of respect (or appear that way) for SSA to essentially watch you tilt at the windmill and giggle? Just how unimportant in the process are we to them? Really to OPM and them. Is it done "for" us, or "to" us? You raise (potentially) interesting thoughts in my head, Gaidan.
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MW2
Full Member
Posts: 49
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Post by MW2 on Jun 8, 2015 12:14:51 GMT -5
I think what all of you folks in this thread really want is a little respect. Watch the little girl in the middle she is gold from beginning to end. Well crud. I can't get the video to post. I will try to find it. Obviously, I haven't seen the video, but that's an interesting point. I wonder to what extent the process just makes one feel disrespected? We don't get to know our score on individual pieces, for the most part. We don't get a time table. We don't get timely informed when we're not chosen. Assuming it is legal (and it is) to "3 strike" someone, there seems to be no real reason to keep it secret except to avoid litigation. On the other hand, some of us spend years and money persuing the process again, when they could make life easier by just saying, "look, we're not going to hire you." I've had really harsh disappointment in my life (ooooh, flashbacks - shiver), and I got past it (except those flashbacks), but could it be a lack of respect (or appear that way) for SSA to essentially watch you tilt at the windmill and giggle? Just how unimportant in the process are we to them? Really to OPM and them. Is it done "for" us, or "to" us? You raise (potentially) interesting thoughts in my head, Gaidan. I agree with you that I would rather know whether or not there is stilll a legitimate chance I will get hired. I also happen to think it is disrespectful to ask candidates to invest so much time and money in the application process and provide them with very little feedback. I know I didn't ace my interview with SSA, but if they really think I tanked it would be nice if they would simply say thanks for your interest and move on. Having been on the first, second, and now third cert lists, and with the assumption I won't get a last minute offer this week, it feels like being rejected for a job opening three different times.
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Post by tinman on Jun 8, 2015 13:37:02 GMT -5
I'm wallowing with you all: Non-vet outsider with a modest GAL (18) and a NOR high enough to be considered for each cert (at least one city has popped up each time). I'd like to be able to tell my wife, "yes, I'm still in the running, be prepared to move the kiddos" or "no, I blew the interview". I'd also like to be able to update my GAL. Life moves on...the GAL does not.
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Post by privateatty on Jun 8, 2015 15:43:31 GMT -5
Obviously, I haven't seen the video, but that's an interesting point. I wonder to what extent the process just makes one feel disrespected? We don't get to know our score on individual pieces, for the most part. We don't get a time table. We don't get timely informed when we're not chosen. Assuming it is legal (and it is) to "3 strike" someone, there seems to be no real reason to keep it secret except to avoid litigation. On the other hand, some of us spend years and money persuing the process again, when they could make life easier by just saying, "look, we're not going to hire you." I've had really harsh disappointment in my life (ooooh, flashbacks - shiver), and I got past it (except those flashbacks), but could it be a lack of respect (or appear that way) for SSA to essentially watch you tilt at the windmill and giggle? Just how unimportant in the process are we to them? Really to OPM and them. Is it done "for" us, or "to" us? You raise (potentially) interesting thoughts in my head, Gaidan. I agree with you that I would rather know whether or not there is stilll a legitimate chance I will get hired. I also happen to think it is disrespectful to ask candidates to invest so much time and money in the application process and provide them with very little feedback. I know I didn't ace my interview with SSA, but if they really think I tanked it would be nice if they would simply say thanks for your interest and move on. Having been on the first, second, and now third cert lists, and with the assumption I won't get a last minute offer this week, it feels like being rejected for a job opening three different times. And that really is it, isn't it? By not being hired and subject to a waiver (I hate to use the term "passed over") or being thrice-struck, the bottom line is the same: they don't want you. You feel like you did on the school yard when two insanely popular kids who were self appointed captains and choosing teams for kickball or some such and they took you only because you were the very last kid. You had to suffer that humiliation. Except this is suppossed to be anonymous, but of course it isn't. Family and references know. They ask the same question, again and again. And there is no "cure". You are on the merry-go-round and can't get off. I hear you--as so many who read this do. You have my heart-felt sympathies. Because you did nothing wrong and everything right. You got this far so one of three things happened: One, you said something in the interview that they didn't like. I think I know what I said and while I don't want to repeat it here, suffice to say that itmay have placed me in the pre-historic category. Puzzle Palace wants folks who can dazzle a 22 yr old Google veteran. Two, you had a reference say or do something that sunk you faster than an angry runner through a cob web. This may be the cruelest blow. Three, you got in the way of favored sons or daughters and had to be thrice struck in order to get rid of you (my likely crime). The only lasting comment I can say beyond the obvious (that you ARE qualified) is that this is some kind of test of your character. It does make you stronger and you are challenged in that it IS easy to wallow in self pity and ultimately to be bitter. I don't want to get all Mary Poppins or rah-rah--this stuff hurts. It had a real toll on me--but then I had a happy ending. So its easy for me to say all this I suppose. Good luck to all of you and keep you chin high and your powder dry.
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