Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2016 13:08:25 GMT -5
I guess I must be looking at a different board. I'm not seeing "too many pro-management" people taking over the board. No job is perfect for everyone. Over the years, clearly, different ALJs perceive this job, and do this job, in their own ways. I would be more suspect if everyone described the various aspects of the job the same way, and felt the same way about management or the work or the people they deal with. Sorry that someone no longer feels like paying here any more, but IMO, creating drama by starting this thread about it was unnecessary and counterproductive, and makes too much work for Pix and ALJD. JMHO, as always. Well, 71stretch, thanks for sharing.
But there have been very few posts at all on this thread, with yours, what 14 posts? And it's about why someone that has contributed greatly over the years to this board decided to leave. I thought it was a worthy topic, you say "creating drama". Since 2013, Elvis has provided more insight to the job of an ALJ than many others and the reason he left was simple.....there are too many non-ALJs giving advice about how to be an ALJ and it feels like a battle just trying to share with others, mainly outsiders, the job of an ALJ.
I sort of condensed his overall opinion, but he was a very active poster as to the day to day activities of an ALJ and it bothers me that he left! Just having a humble opinion telling other Judges that they are "drama creating" types is not really a humble opinion, do you think? IMHO Tiger
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Post by 71stretch on Jan 22, 2016 14:21:57 GMT -5
I guess I must be looking at a different board. I'm not seeing "too many pro-management" people taking over the board. No job is perfect for everyone. Over the years, clearly, different ALJs perceive this job, and do this job, in their own ways. I would be more suspect if everyone described the various aspects of the job the same way, and felt the same way about management or the work or the people they deal with. Sorry that someone no longer feels like paying here any more, but IMO, creating drama by starting this thread about it was unnecessary and counterproductive, and makes too much work for Pix and ALJD. JMHO, as always. Well, 71stretch, thanks for sharing.
But there has been very little posts at all on this thread, with yours, what 14 posts? And it's about why someone that has contributed greatly over the years to this board decided to leave. I thought it was a worthy topic, you say "creating drama". Since 2013, Elvis has provided more insight to the job of an ALJ than many others and the reason he left was simple.....there are too many non-ALJs giving advice about how to be an ALJ and it feels like a battle just trying to share with others, mainly outsiders, the job of an ALJ.
I sort of condensed his overall opinion, but he was a very active poster as to the day to day activities of an ALJ and it bothers me that he left! Just having a humble opinion telling other Judges that they are "drama creating" types is not really a humble opinion, do you think? IMHO Tiger
I just do not perceive the massive change in this board that this poster saw, I am sorry that anyone feels the need to leave because of a perceived change in tone or subject matter. There was a big shift beginning with the new applications on 2013. A few took exception, not all of them publicly, and left. I am not sure what is accomplished by publicly announcing someone's departure and the reasons why. So the "pro-management" will change their tune, or watch their backs, or leave? Or so those who feel otherwise will become more vocal? Whichever, it doesn't matter to me. Glad it's not turning out to be work for Pix. Carry on!
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Jan 22, 2016 14:40:50 GMT -5
Check your PM, "humble one".
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Post by ibnlurkin on Jan 22, 2016 15:07:40 GMT -5
I'm an outsider so I too find some of these "frank discussions" some of the most valuable insights available on this board.
I respectfully suggest some of these "franker" discussions are closed too quickly. After all we're all supposed to have highly developed critical reading skills........some of this info... particularly concerning the division of labor in various office etc is crucially important regardless of whether sitting judges and other insiders agree about what it all means....
The strength of the opinions held only serves to underscore the importance of the info it concerns.
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Post by auroraborealis on Jan 22, 2016 15:29:01 GMT -5
I'm an outsider so I too find some of these "frank discussions" some of the most valuable insights available on this board. I respectfully suggest some of these "franker" discussions are closed too quickly. After all we're all supposed to have highly developed critical reading skills........some of this info... particularly concerning the division of labor in various office etc is crucially important regardless of whether sitting judges and other insiders agree about what it all means.... The strength of the opinions held only serves to underscore the importance of the info it concerns. I second this.
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Post by Pixie on Jan 22, 2016 15:50:58 GMT -5
I dislike closing threads, but sometimes there isn't a choice. When posters fail to heed my suggestions, it can get ugly. The next step is issuing a directive. Failing to heed a directive will garner one a vacation from the board.
Sometimes when I have suggested a change in tenor, with no heed, then that too will result in a vacation. All of this is time consuming. I am not here for another full time, or even a part time, job. Pixie.
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elvis
Full Member
Viva Falls Church!
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Post by elvis on Jan 22, 2016 17:40:19 GMT -5
Just to be clear, I have not left the building. But I am not the forum legend in question.
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Post by Peabody on Jan 22, 2016 18:06:29 GMT -5
Pixie or any moderator working for all of us,
We greatly appreciate what you are doing. I never comment because that is how I prefer to conduct myself (and that is not a dig on commenters - I am just happy to have you guys and gals speak out!). Notwithstanding the above, I did not see anything that was terrible on the thread (perhaps because it was already deleted) but I thought it was weird that after one member expressed concern over another leaving, that yet another member gave his or her "humble" opinion about how it was foolhardy perhaps to comment on such an event, and then that same member followed TL to another post to comment on his name change. It JUST seemed weird and sort of like that member may have been goading the other. I'm certainly not trying to get on any bandwagon and I just as certainly hope that it is not the case, but as shy of a poster as I plan on being, I feel even more so dedicated to that approach if people are going to stalk the boards to goad anyone. Just a thought, and again, I absolutely could have misread the post.
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Post by Peabody on Jan 22, 2016 18:10:39 GMT -5
Again, so thankful to even be on here stressing about the subjects that consume us all. Just wanting to express my thoughts on this odd topic.
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Post by nappyloxs on Jan 22, 2016 21:41:27 GMT -5
As a longtime lurker, I have to say it is sad to see 2 great contributors go. Since I have been on the board, many great contributors have left. I hope this isn't a sign of things too come.
I haven't seen too much "pro-management" discussions on the board, but everyone views things differently. I may not be an ALJ yet, but I think ALJ could benefit from some of my insight as a GS (and trust me, I'm not pro management. Management doesn't have a clue most of the time since those who really make the "policies" are from operations). As an insider, I think some members use this forum to vent anonymously. A "dw" (aka attorney) may come across as "being smart than an ALJ" or being "pro-management" after she has spent years drafting decisions from 1/2 a page instructions, when all she really is saying is how she would like to write instructions if she became a judge. The arguments of who completes disposition codes should frankly constitute government waste. In the end, judges don't care about management, and that is fine since it is well with their rights under APA, but they do care when non-judges imply they know more.
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Post by hopefalj on Jan 23, 2016 15:48:23 GMT -5
I swear, I will stop after this. I sound cranky because I am. I will have to account for why only a few cases were decided this week but nobody will take responsibility for the fact that the staff is not moving the cases. On the issue of 'turf protection,' the problem is that once you take on the duty assignment of any other employee (who is till getting paid to do the job) it will become yours forever, but you will never be given any credit for doing it nor will you be relieved of the responsibility for deciding whatever arbitrary number of cases management says you must decide. So sure, I could do the clerical work for the staff, I could also answer the phones....is this and ego issue? I don't think so. Working up your own case files, exhibiting documents, checking on clerical deadlines, etc. is not an ego thing as that's someone's specified job duties. Refusing to learn how to operate the VTC unit's basic controls, refusing to learn and use email, sending decisions back because they were written in third person and you want it in first but won't bother learning the tool in Word, etc. are a different story. I've seen 600-word diatribes that took 15+ minutes to write on these "not my job" types of things, things that take all of 1 minute to learn and 15 seconds to implement once they're learned. These things are ego driven, IMO, but others can have differing opinions, of course.
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Post by ok1956 on Jan 24, 2016 22:33:34 GMT -5
I have to say I was sad watching this unfold on Friday. Ironically (I suppose), I was at home using credit hours so I would not lose them. I actually do that (without any complaint from our HOCALJ) every other Friday. I am fairly certain that "Elvis" (who I know and fairly quickly confirmed identity) would not have wanted the mini-board war and the subsequent departure of Tiger Law. I am now back on my laptop (and ready for work tomorrow) but wanted to briefly say what has been said much better by others. This is a board to share information, support, WAGs and opinions. We should all be tolerant of others' opinions - they are after all, just opinions although often believed by the holder to be the absolute truth. There have been times when I have disagreed with something posted as "fact" when in actuality my experience is diametrically opposed. I don't make a habit of calling anyone out on the board publicly but choose to either ignore, provide my own experience or privately communicate with the poster to explain how my experience (almost a year, so definitely not vast) has differed. I truly appreciate ALJD and Pixie for keeping this board civil and informative. And for those who have gotten "the call" congratulations! And for those still waiting - good luck! It is a great job.
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Post by phoenixrakkasan on Jan 24, 2016 23:36:29 GMT -5
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Post by bartleby on Jan 25, 2016 8:59:56 GMT -5
You know, this Board was designed and administrated for non-ALJ's. It is for the sharing of information regarding the hiring process and the position. Only ALJ's can relay their opinion of the position. With that in mind, once one becomes and ALJ, this Board is of little use. The workload is strenuous and why should one spend time on something that has no benefit to them. I contribute sparingly as I still appreciate all those that assisted me and I am attempting to pay it forward. With that said, there will come a day when I no longer find the time or the Board amusing enough to contribute. We miss the great ones over the years, but then there is someone new.. May the Gods that be never let Pixie wander far.. Blessings to all.
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Post by Gaidin on Jan 25, 2016 9:26:12 GMT -5
And we greatly appreciate it Bart.
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Post by valkyrie on Jan 25, 2016 10:45:37 GMT -5
You know, this Board was designed and administrated for non-ALJ's. It is for the sharing of information regarding the hiring process and the position. Only ALJ's can relay their opinion of the position. With that in mind, once one becomes and ALJ, this Board is of little use. The workload is strenuous and why should one spend time on something that has no benefit to them. I contribute sparingly as I still appreciate all those that assisted me and I am attempting to pay it forward. With that said, there will come a day when I no longer find the time or the Board amusing enough to contribute. We miss the great ones over the years, but then there is someone new.. May the Gods that be never let Pixie wander far.. Blessings to all. Well said Bartleby. This site was a God-send during my dark days of suffering through the hiring process. The collective knowledge and suffering of your fellow site-members will help you through a slow, bewildering and ever-changing process that you promised yourself that you would not let get to you. Just the idea that you may have gotten a little more insight into the process than you had before can be just as comforting as realizing that you were not the only highly qualified candidate to get passed over in the most recent hiring. As you would expect from any group, the people posting here are a fascinating array of intellectuals, drama-queens, jokers, cranks, know-it-alls, idealists, etc. Figuring out which posts are useful is actually pretty good practice for the job! Out of a 1000 pages of MER, which 10 pages are actually relevant? Is the claimant telling the truth, exaggerating, or flat-out lying? Some of the claimants are actually pretty interesting people that don't really contribute much to the case, but you enjoy your time with them. There are also longstanding controversies, like Insider vs Outsider, or Pro-management vs Unmanageable, which is a lot like "Fibromyalgia, Fact or Fiction?",or "To ME, or Not to ME?". Just remember not to take any of this too personally, because staying on here WILL help you through the process. Thanks again Pixie from one of the many satisfied customers of ALJ Discussion Forum.
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Post by Pixie on Jan 25, 2016 12:12:00 GMT -5
You are certainly welcome, Valkyrie. I was beginning to worry that you had taken a ride and left us. If you get a chance, send me a PM and let me know where you are these days. Pixie.
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Post by hapi2balj on Jan 25, 2016 12:34:51 GMT -5
I'm sorry to lose the insights and opinions of anyone; however, I'd like to think that no one would strive to manipulate this Board for personal agenda. All of us are in this together, after all. If members have concluded they need to withdraw from this Forum, I regret that but of course must respect their decisions.
While I am thrilled to be a member of the February 8 start group, and really consider this job to be a blessing, I'm quite sure that the ALJ role is not without its issues. I had a job for 15 years which was my "dream job," truly, but it still had its days when I would've traded it for a Diet Coke...and I have always detested Diet Coke. Of course, the ALJ position has to vary from ODAR to ODAR, and from season to season. Personality of co-workers, especially any with actual or perceived "authority" over the ALJ, always will be one critical factor among many others.
I've been a member of the Bar for more years than not and have had a fairly wide-ranging and varied career, including some management responsibilities, but one thing I never have been is part of a union. While I'm certainly glad (and am sure will come to appreciate more and more) that there is an organized voice for ALJs, I will tread particularly gingerly re: that aspect of the job until I find my way. Definitely, I will take to heart the advice to carefully read and learn all that's provided for and promised to me.
What I know is, if I can "do this job justice," it will be a good place for me to serve for the remaining years of my career. Perhaps I am too old to be as idealistic as I sound - and actually feel. Or maybe I'm discovering that the idealism of youth wasn't such a bad place to be after all.
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Post by jagvet on Jan 25, 2016 14:24:40 GMT -5
Hapi2balj, You have nailed the one thing that I find weird, if I, too, ever get to don the robe. I had to become a Teamster to drive an ice cream truck one summer in college, but all of my government service (state and federal), and in-house corporate has been MANAGEMENT. It will be strange to be a member of a collective bargaining unit. Also, when I read the union's web postings, the rhetoric seems a bit over the top for judges. If and when I get "the Call", I'll study up on the CBA, but again, it does feel weird. On the other hand, even as a federal manager, I have had some lousy bosses, so it may end up being nice to have the additional protection of representation.
On the thread here of Elvis and Tiger, I am sorry to see them go. While I have observed some misinformation and false leads pop up, it always seemed well-intended. This board is like a conversation--sometimes people speculate, and sometimes they make statements that experienced people like JudgeRatty, Gaidan, Gary, Tigerlaw or Elvis can set straight. No big deal. Just keep following the conversation and draw your own conclusions. Even silly stuff like, "should I wear a tie to the interview?" was fun to read. This is a byzantine path, and until I found the board last summer, I thought I was the only person in the world applying who wasn't a long-time SSA insider.
Don't quit, anyone.
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Post by hapi2balj on Jan 25, 2016 17:17:47 GMT -5
You know, this Board was designed and administrated for non-ALJ's. It is for the sharing of information regarding the hiring process and the position. Only ALJ's can relay their opinion of the position. With that in mind, once one becomes and ALJ, this Board is of little use. The workload is strenuous and why should one spend time on something that has no benefit to them. I contribute sparingly as I still appreciate all those that assisted me and I am attempting to pay it forward. With that said, there will come a day when I no longer find the time or the Board amusing enough to contribute. We miss the great ones over the years, but then there is someone new.. May the Gods that be never let Pixie wander far.. Blessings to all. Bart, I really have appreciated your contributions, and too hope to be able to pay it forward as I move into the ALJ position and gain more insider knowledge. I hear you, though, about time constraints. We will have to see...agree, very much, that stalwarts like Pix are invaluable.
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