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Post by prescient on Feb 5, 2016 8:52:14 GMT -5
Soldak, if you are 10-point vet, have 10 years of experience outside the agency, and are now an insider and are liked by management and the ALJs, you have every conceivable advantage you can possibly have (and can apply at your leisure). Now if your mangers/ALJs don't like you, well that pretty much negates the first two advantages. My managers seems to like me. But who really knows.
Interesting issue from mentioning whether "my" ALJs like me,
I write at one of the new NCACs. (National Case Assistance Centers). I actually write for hundreds of different ALJs. I'm in my 2nd year and don't remember writing for the same ALJ twice. I don't have ALJ relationships even though I'm an "insider." However, I have been exposed to so many different and conceivable ways for ALJs to do instructions and to decide cases that I would like to feel it better prepares me than writing for the same handful of ALJs.
Do the hundreds of NCAC writers have a disadvantage in the application process compared to "insiders" with ALJ relationships?
(P.S. I am awaiting my 10 point vet paperwork to process at the VA. I only have 5 pt at the moment or I would have already applied.)
I think working at an NCAC will make it slightly more difficult. As you indicated, because you never write for the same ALJ, or so infrequently, you're never going to establish a relationship from which you can list an ALJ as a reference. Also, at NCAC, my understanding is that you are only permitted to write. You can't develop the case record, interact with reps to discuss things like amending the onset date, mentor other writers, organize training sessions, participate in prehearing conferences, assist with mentoring new ALJS, or review cases for possible OTRs. Given that you have other outside experience, this won't be a huge deal for you personally, as far as OPM is concerned, but it might for SSA.
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Post by msp on Feb 5, 2016 9:09:50 GMT -5
Once a candidate is on a certificate, she is now being considered for a location for which she is one of three candidates for that location. Then and only then, comes the interview with SSA. That is where the recommendation for hiring (or not) comes into play. Hope this helps. Any more questions? Just ask. Pixie. I do have a few questions. The only opportunity for the interview with SSA is once you've made your first cert? Making the registry/getting a decent NOR simply means you're hanging out, waiting for certs to be released, right? For some reason, I thought the interview with SSA came shortly after NORs but before certs - I think because folks make multiple certs, some over several years - or perhaps I haven't yet had enough coffee this morning.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2016 9:17:28 GMT -5
I think working at an NCAC will make it slightly more difficult. As you indicated, because you never write for the same ALJ, or so infrequently, you're never going to establish a relationship from which you can list an ALJ as a reference. Also, at NCAC, my understanding is that you are only permitted to write. You can't develop the case record, interact with reps to discuss things like amending the onset date, mentor other writers, organize training sessions, participate in prehearing conferences, assist with mentoring new ALJS, or review cases for possible OTRs. Given that you have other outside experience, this won't be a huge deal for you personally, as far as OPM is concerned, but it might for SSA. We do get the chance to mentor other writers, and organize training sessions. However, you are dead-on with the other aspects NCAC writers are missing in their work experience compared to HO AA/DWs. I should be transferring to a HO within the month so hopefully by time I would get an ALJ interview in 6-18 months I'll have both NCAC and HO experience. There is a new program I think that allows NCAC writers to do short term details to HOs. I would highly encourage NCAC writers who are considering applying for ALJ to take advantage of such an opportunity.
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Post by Gaidin on Feb 5, 2016 9:18:12 GMT -5
Once a candidate is on a certificate, she is now being considered for a location for which she is one of three candidates for that location. Then and only then, comes the interview with SSA. That is where the recommendation for hiring (or not) comes into play. Hope this helps. Any more questions? Just ask. Pixie. I do have a few questions. The only opportunity for the interview with SSA is once you've made your first cert? Making the registry/getting a decent NOR simply means you're hanging out, waiting for certs to be released, right? For some reason, I thought the interview with SSA came shortly after NORs but before certs - I think because folks make multiple certs, some over several years - or perhaps I haven't yet had enough coffee this morning. You have a structured interview (SI) with ALJs brought in by OPM during the DC phase of the testing process. A passing score on this SI is necessary to receive a grade on your NOR and the score is factored into the NOR. Each agency will interview the applicants from the register who appear on their certs. With ODAR you get 1 interview for the life of the register and it is after you have appeared on your first cert.
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Post by Gaidin on Feb 5, 2016 9:18:43 GMT -5
I think working at an NCAC will make it slightly more difficult. As you indicated, because you never write for the same ALJ, or so infrequently, you're never going to establish a relationship from which you can list an ALJ as a reference. Also, at NCAC, my understanding is that you are only permitted to write. You can't develop the case record, interact with reps to discuss things like amending the onset date, mentor other writers, organize training sessions, participate in prehearing conferences, assist with mentoring new ALJS, or review cases for possible OTRs. Given that you have other outside experience, this won't be a huge deal for you personally, as far as OPM is concerned, but it might for SSA. We do get the chance to mentor other writers, and organize training sessions. However, you are dead-on with the other aspects NCAC writers are missing in their work experience compared to HO AA/DWs. I should be transferring to a HO within the month so hopefully by time I would get an ALJ interview in 6-18 months I'll have both NCAC and HO experience. There is a new program I think that allows NCAC writers to do short term details to HOs. I would highly encourage NCAC writers who are considering applying for ALJ to take advantage of such an opportunity. bwahahahaha he said 6 months.......
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Post by Pixie on Feb 5, 2016 9:34:38 GMT -5
Once a candidate is on a certificate, she is now being considered for a location for which she is one of three candidates for that location. Then and only then, comes the interview with SSA. That is where the recommendation for hiring (or not) comes into play. Hope this helps. Any more questions? Just ask. Pixie. I do have a few questions. The only opportunity for the interview with SSA is once you've made your first cert? Making the registry/getting a decent NOR simply means you're hanging out, waiting for certs to be released, right? For some reason, I thought the interview with SSA came shortly after NORs but before certs - I think because folks make multiple certs, some over several years - or perhaps I haven't yet had enough coffee this morning.
Gaidin has answered your question, so I won't elaborate. I think more coffee would be a good idea.
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Post by msp on Feb 5, 2016 9:53:58 GMT -5
I do have a few questions. The only opportunity for the interview with SSA is once you've made your first cert? Making the registry/getting a decent NOR simply means you're hanging out, waiting for certs to be released, right? For some reason, I thought the interview with SSA came shortly after NORs but before certs - I think because folks make multiple certs, some over several years - or perhaps I haven't yet had enough coffee this morning. You have a structured interview (SI) with ALJs brought in by OPM during the DC phase of the testing process. A passing score on this SI is necessary to receive a grade on your NOR and the score is factored into the NOR. Each agency will interview the applicants from the register who appear on their certs. With ODAR you get 1 interview for the life of the register and it is after you have appeared on your first cert. Okay, thanks, that clears things up - I had the SI in late Oct, just waiting on that Special Little Email. Now, for a 2nd cup of coffee.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2016 9:58:30 GMT -5
We do get the chance to mentor other writers, and organize training sessions. However, you are dead-on with the other aspects NCAC writers are missing in their work experience compared to HO AA/DWs. I should be transferring to a HO within the month so hopefully by time I would get an ALJ interview in 6-18 months I'll have both NCAC and HO experience. There is a new program I think that allows NCAC writers to do short term details to HOs. I would highly encourage NCAC writers who are considering applying for ALJ to take advantage of such an opportunity. bwahahahaha he said 6 months....... I am awaiting my 10 pt vet paperwork. I understand that they d0 10 pt vet interviews every 4 months in a batch. Wrong?
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Post by funkyodar on Feb 5, 2016 10:02:57 GMT -5
Soldack and other NCAC writers:
I try to send a thank you email to you folks everytime I get a good draft from you. I know many other judges do as well. Keep a file of those. It's not the same as having a day to day relationship with a group of ALJs like you would in a HO, and just because I sent a TY email once doesn't mean I can be a reference for you, but it gives you something to show your supervisor before they answer OPMs questions about you.
Good luck
Funk
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Post by Gaidin on Feb 5, 2016 10:09:02 GMT -5
bwahahahaha he said 6 months....... I am awaiting my 10 pt vet paperwork. I understand that they did 10 pt vet interviews every 4 months. Wrong? Once you start the testing process you should expect it to take a year to get your scores. Your mileage may vary but based upon how long the folks who tested between October and December have waited it doesn't seem like OPM has sped the process up much. That doesn't mean they haven't achieved efficiencies it just means they don't appear to be speeding up the process. After that you have to wait to show up on a cert before you will get interviewed by ODAR.
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Post by Deleted on Feb 5, 2016 10:16:46 GMT -5
I am awaiting my 10 pt vet paperwork. I understand that they did 10 pt vet interviews every 4 months. Wrong? Once you start the testing process you should expect it to take a year to get your scores. Your mileage may vary but based upon how long the folks who tested between October and December have waited it doesn't seem like OPM has sped the process up much. That doesn't mean they haven't achieved efficiencies it just means they don't appear to be speeding up the process. After that you have to wait to show up on a cert before you will get interviewed by ODAR. Oh wow. I really didn't understand the timeline as well as I thought. Guess I'll have to watch my diet and keep exercising to maintain my figure. Otherwise, a may not fit into the black robe I ordered last weekend....
But seriously, that is a depressingly long timeline for the 21st century. I thought the delay would involve the sheer number of applicants they have to wade through, but these smaller batches taking that long really doesn't make sense.
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Post by yodapug on Feb 5, 2016 10:28:16 GMT -5
I do have a few questions. The only opportunity for the interview with SSA is once you've made your first cert? Making the registry/getting a decent NOR simply means you're hanging out, waiting for certs to be released, right? For some reason, I thought the interview with SSA came shortly after NORs but before certs - I think because folks make multiple certs, some over several years - or perhaps I haven't yet had enough coffee this morning. You have a structured interview (SI) with ALJs brought in by OPM during the DC phase of the testing process. A passing score on this SI is necessary to receive a grade on your NOR and the score is factored into the NOR. Each agency will interview the applicants from the register who appear on their certs. With ODAR you get 1 interview for the life of the register and it is after you have appeared on your first cert. Gaidin, With the one interview for the life of the register, would getting past over for hiring be indicative that ODAR is simply not going to hire you, or do you still have a chance to get hired later?
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Post by sealaw90 on Feb 5, 2016 10:36:35 GMT -5
Once you start the testing process you should expect it to take a year to get your scores. Your mileage may vary but based upon how long the folks who tested between October and December have waited it doesn't seem like OPM has sped the process up much. That doesn't mean they haven't achieved efficiencies it just means they don't appear to be speeding up the process. After that you have to wait to show up on a cert before you will get interviewed by ODAR. Oh wow. I really didn't understand the timeline as well as I thought. Guess I'll have to watch my diet and keep exercising to maintain my figure. Otherwise, a may not fit into the black robe I ordered last weekend....
But seriously, that is a depressingly long timeline for the 21st century. I thought the delay would involve the sheer number of applicants they have to wade through, but these smaller batches taking that long really doesn't make sense.
Well, next month will mark the 3rd Anniversary of the application that created the current register. Not sure if 6-18 months was a short or depressingly long time for you, but I would double that for a more realistic outlook. BTW it sounds like the time at NCAC is meaningless for years needed to prove litigation experience.
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Post by Gaidin on Feb 5, 2016 10:44:52 GMT -5
You have a structured interview (SI) with ALJs brought in by OPM during the DC phase of the testing process. A passing score on this SI is necessary to receive a grade on your NOR and the score is factored into the NOR. Each agency will interview the applicants from the register who appear on their certs. With ODAR you get 1 interview for the life of the register and it is after you have appeared on your first cert. Gaidin, With the one interview for the life of the register, would getting past over for hiring be indicative that ODAR is simply not going to hire you, or do you still have a chance to get hired later? Someone hired this last round of hiring was on every set of certs on this register and finally hit pay dirt so no. There was a story from an earlier round of hiring off this register of someone who had been on the prior register for years and then got hired off this one. So yes you still may get hired. How good or bad your chance is...... “So we beat on, boats against the current, borne back ceaselessly into the past.” - F. Scott Fitgerald
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Post by Gaidin on Feb 5, 2016 10:47:19 GMT -5
Once you start the testing process you should expect it to take a year to get your scores. Your mileage may vary but based upon how long the folks who tested between October and December have waited it doesn't seem like OPM has sped the process up much. That doesn't mean they haven't achieved efficiencies it just means they don't appear to be speeding up the process. After that you have to wait to show up on a cert before you will get interviewed by ODAR. Oh wow. I really didn't understand the timeline as well as I thought. Guess I'll have to watch my diet and keep exercising to maintain my figure. Otherwise, a may not fit into the black robe I ordered last weekend....
But seriously, that is a depressingly long timeline for the 21st century. I thought the delay would involve the sheer number of applicants they have to wade through, but these smaller batches taking that long really doesn't make sense.
Go look at the immigration judge thread and realize that getting hired to be any kind of judge is a slow and very deliberate process. Once hired you are being handed very significant responsibilities and in the case of ALJs significant protections against being fired. As such the people doing the hiring don't want to rush it.
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Post by JenMPR on Feb 7, 2016 8:56:38 GMT -5
Other than Puerto Rico, are there offices that require an ALJ to have Spanish fluency? btw, Ponce is a 90 minute drive from San Juan, but Mayaguez is over 2 hours (w/o traffic). My two vacations to PR left me feeling like its a paradise that I would never hate being assigned there. Maybe I am wrong, but all the PR locations are going to be on my list... I included all 3 locations as well. I wonder how many ALJ's they're looking to hire in Puerto Rico...
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