Current ALJs - your thoughts on the job?

[gazoo]

I know most people love the job, but what are the downsides? What do you wish you had known before taking the job?

[superalj]

I love the job-best job I’ve ever had. The downside is job security and judicial independence due to recent SCOTUS and circuit case law. I think that ALJs will eventually be at will to the executive branch without for cause protection, which could reduce our judicial independence.

[peacemaker]

I have to say that the biggest drawback for me is the lack of variety. Once you’ve learned the substantive law, you apply it over and over, with the same structure of proof, in every case. The facts vary, of course, but that only helps so much. If you are used to a more intellectually stimulating job, this one may disappoint you. The fact that our hearings are not adversarial also makes them less interesting.

[ssaogc]

The job does become repetitive but you can deal with it and you go on cruise control.

I am in a decent office and most of the folks there are happy and want to be there.

For me, the only downside is Management. We have some real geniuses running things and they want to treat you as if you were one of their subordinates. They move your cases to different statuses against your instructions. They take every opportunity to frustrate you in your processes. It is all about the numbers for them. If one ALJ is dragging Ass, new procedures are implemented that apply to all ALJs in office instead of addressing the deadwood ALJ.

[hopefalj]

I’d echo a lot of what was said above about repetition, etc.

I’d add that you are largely at the mercy of others with your cases. Have a lazy or incompetent HCSR? You can spend a lot of time either documenting the issues to send to management to get a shrug in return or you’re going to get to spend a lot of time doing someone else’s job to ensure you don’t get remands for something technical. You’ll have multiple cases moved to ALPO on the same day after sitting in POST for a month longer than necessary.

You have a bad decision writer or multiple bad decision writers? You can kill yourself making the decision legally sufficient (at a minimum) or keep your notes for the remand hearing. You can ask that certain cases go to your good writers, but you can grind them into the ground and crush their DWPI by dumping complicated, lengthy decisions on them. (Pro-tip… if you do ask that a difficult case be assigned to a writer, keep an eye out for an easy one to also have assigned to them to help balance their workload).

Want to go on vacation? Everyone else’s workload doesn’t stop with yours, so you can come back to a substantial pile of edits and ALPOs when you return. Then you get to try and whittle that down while reviewing and hearing cases, creating a sort of scramble effect. And if you don’t catch up within the specified time, management will ask you what is going on despite having access to your leave records.

You get to try and plan your life out months in advance to provide the office your hearing calendar. It’s not that big of a deal to me, but I know some judges that found it to be miserable.

I don’t think it’s the best job in the world, but it beats a lot of other options. Making peace with a lot of things and borrowing from Elsa by letting things go has made the job far easier on my psyche than it had been when I worried about the decision quality, what the AC and District Court will do, etc.

[superalj]

I still worry about quality and remands as my name goes on that decision regardless of who drafts the decision.

For the newbies coming on board, listen to your mentors, set your expectations with the DWing as some will test you, and establish good relationships with the management team-your GS can really make your life easier. As a recovering member of ALJ management, send those poorly written decisions back and email your management team about poor work quality. I know it’s time consuming but you have to document poor work quality to get anything to change. Don’t be “that ALJ” but advise management when your expectations aren’t met. Again, you will have a mentor to help with these issues.

Lastly, to my colleagues dissatisfied with management, apply for HOCALJ. I’ve been in a few offices where the more senior ALJs didn’t want the extra work and ended up with a poor HOCALJ. A strong HOCALJ sets the tone for the entire office and I’ve been so pleasantly surprised at the improvement in HOCALJ leadership generally since I’ve been with SSA.

[ssaogc]

Jun 14, 2022 21:20:10 GMT -5 superalj said:

I still worry about quality and remands as my name goes on that decision regardless of who drafts the decision.

For the newbies coming on board, listen to your mentors, set your expectations with the DWing as some will test you, and establish good relationships with the management team-your GS can really make your life easier. As a recovering member of ALJ management, send those poorly written decisions back and email your management team about poor work quality. I know it’s time consuming but you have to document poor work quality to get anything to change. Don’t be “that ALJ” but advise management when your expectations aren’t met. Again, you will have a mentor to help with these issues.

Lastly, to my colleagues dissatisfied with management, apply for HOCALJ. I’ve been in a few offices where the more senior ALJs didn’t want the extra work and ended up with a poor HOCALJ. A strong HOCALJ sets the tone for the entire office and I’ve been so pleasantly surprised at the improvement in HOCALJ leadership generally since I’ve been with SSA.

I wish I could be HOCALJ but I am not leaving my dream location because of the management in my office, I will just do my best to minimize their misguided and misdirected actions/requirements.  

the HOCALJ at my office is there for life. No complaints about him. He lets us do our jobs and does not like conflict. He can keep that job and all the meetings and re engineering of the wheel, like the centralized CSU initiative or the micro managing of dismissals to include review and approval  of dismissals when claimant asked for withdrawal or when the claimant died and there is no SOP. 

every office is different. Some writers will write poor decisions and you may as well talk to the wall to get that to change.  They do not work for you and management has so many meetings and is so worried about aged cases and other metrics that they do not have the time or desire to put a substandard employee on a performance improvement plan to set up a Chapter 43 removal case that will stand up at the MSPB. I have seen it myself ALJ spends time and effort with management on substandard employee and result is that the substandard employee is rotated to some other position or they just do not write for the ALJ anymore. 

I would be remiss if I did not mention that the current management system does have its benefits. It is not all bad. For example. Computer not working? DRAP not recording? Missing VHR? video not working? IM, call or e-mail management, it is their problem to solve. In my prior jobs I owned these types of problems and had to go get them fixed or fix the, myself. And when I first showed up at SSA I had this mentality but have come to realize that doing such is not in my lane and I have learned to stay in my lane. 

Most writers do a great job and their decisions still come back on remand—-there is just no way to prevent those remands. Accept that they are part of the landscape, do what they ask and move on. I got one from district court this year that basically said I should have believed the claimant’s testimony because in their opinion it was supported by the medical evidence and that I should have paid him (they used a little different language but I read between the lines). Well written decision by one of our best writers. I just paid it OTR, why am I going to twist myself into a knot, hold another hearing  in order to not pay it? I wish they would have paid it themselves, since they can do that. 

this is not to bad mouth the job. It is a great job, but accept things for what they are and work around them. Do not get bogged down and spend your time and effort trying to get a 20 plus year agency employee who should not be a writer to change or be removed. Deal with the adversity the best way you can and there will be a lot of grief saved.

I schedule the 50 they want a month, I review claim files, I hear cases, make decisions based on agency directives and regulations, write instructions, review/edit drafts and sign the decisions.  Excellent job if you can get it 

[patiently]

I would concur that monotony can be an issue and the Agency is not very good about giving ALJs opportunities to branch out or expand their horizons. Seems like you can do management, union or training but even those options are pretty locked down in terms of who is already doing them. I do also think that the HOCALJ position should rotate among ALJs the same way they do in University academic departments although I realize many ALJs don't want the hassle of administration.

[judicature]

Pay and benefits are hard to beat for a judge job, especially if you end up living in fly over country.

Agency is pretty liberal in allowing outside activities - even paid ones - as long as it does not interfere with your work. There is a process that has to be followed with annual renewals of outside activities, but I have found some outlets for other interests that have helped serve as a change of pace from the ritual and routine of being an SSA ALJ.

[tsatty]

I was in private practice for the bulk of my career. I find being an ALJ to be dull compared to private practice. I also had to move my family across the country to become an ALJ. Having said as much, I’d do it all over again in a heartbeat. The pay is comparable to being an associate at a large law firm, but without the BS. I have no worries about a malpractice suit or being grieved. I don’t have to chase clients. I work 40 hours a week. I set my own schedule. No one can tell me how to decide my cases or do my job. I have a lot more spare time. And I lost 40 lbs since leaving private practice as I have time to exercise.

[abthejd]

Jun 15, 2022 10:43:29 GMT -5 judicature said:

Pay and benefits are hard to beat for a judge job, especially if you end up living in fly over country.

Agency is pretty liberal in allowing outside activities - even paid ones - as long as it does not interfere with your work. There is a process that has to be followed with annual renewals of outside activities, but I have found some outlets for other interests that have helped serve as a change of pace from the ritual and routine of being an SSA ALJ.

For someone interested in indulging in outside activities, do you mind sharing what type of work you have found outside the agency?

[superalj]

Jun 16, 2022 18:05:39 GMT -5 abthejd said:

Jun 15, 2022 10:43:29 GMT -5 judicature said:

Pay and benefits are hard to beat for a judge job, especially if you end up living in fly over country.

Agency is pretty liberal in allowing outside activities - even paid ones - as long as it does not interfere with your work. There is a process that has to be followed with annual renewals of outside activities, but I have found some outlets for other interests that have helped serve as a change of pace from the ritual and routine of being an SSA ALJ.

For someone interested in indulging in outside activities, do you mind sharing what type of work you have found outside the agency?

Do tell. With rampant inflation and the market tanking, and I am definitely interested in a side hustle.

[dwesq]

Jun 16, 2022 21:23:28 GMT -5 superalj said:

Jun 16, 2022 18:05:39 GMT -5 abthejd said:

For someone interested in indulging in outside activities, do you mind sharing what type of work you have found outside the agency?

Do tell. With rampant inflation and the market tanking, and I am definitely interested in a side hustle.

Following. 

I know attorneys who do bail review hearings either for the state or they contract with private firms to cover bail review hearings during non business hours or on weekends. 

[Pixie]

I know an ALJ who sits as special judge for a state court judge friend of his. No pay is involved but he likes the change of scenery and enjoys the adversarial nature of the trials and hearings. Pixie

[Rabbit Bat Reindeer]

Jun 14, 2022 15:31:43 GMT -5 gazoo said:

I know most people love the job, but what are the downsides? What do you wish you had known before taking the job?

So many great points above.

Your enjoyment of this position will be mostly (but not entirely) tied to your personality and whether you can refine your own work processes to be most time-efficient. I've found that my dominant personality trait (I care, but don't care too much) has served me well. You can't fight every silly directive from above. You can't chase down every last detail of every case. You can get mad at stupid remands, I don't want to take that away from anyone. Even I do that.

Just be cool and keep the widgets moving while earning a great salary and government bennies. 

[nylawyer]

Jun 22, 2022 13:16:36 GMT -5 Rabbit Bat Reindeer said:

Jun 14, 2022 15:31:43 GMT -5 gazoo said:

I know most people love the job, but what are the downsides? What do you wish you had known before taking the job?

So many great points above.

Your enjoyment of this position will be mostly (but not entirely) tied to your personality and whether you can refine your own work processes to be most time-efficient. I've found that my dominant personality trait (I care, but don't care too much) has served me well. You can't fight every silly directive from above. You can't chase down every last detail of every case. You can get mad at stupid remands, I don't want to take that away from anyone. Even I do that.

Just be cool and keep the widgets moving while earning a great salary and government bennies. 

You actually can't get too mad about the remands either. I can tell you from first hand experience, having wasted plenty of time trying to do something about it.

[judicature]

I apologize for the delay. I haven't logged back in for a while.

Similar to what others have described, it is part time legal work for which I am paid. You have to avoid anything that overlaps with SSA, and you can never represent anyone before a federal agency. And, of course, you can't do the work on federal property or during duty hours.

[superalj]

Jun 29, 2022 16:13:32 GMT -5 judicature said:

I apologize for the delay. I haven't logged back in for a while.

Similar to what others have described, it is part time legal work for which I am paid. You have to avoid anything that overlaps with SSA, and you can never represent anyone before a federal agency. And, of course, you can't do the work on federal property or during duty hours.

An an already ALJ who lives in an expensive locale struggling with inflation, your post is the most interesting post I’ve seen in a long time. Do tell…teaching? representing clients? research and writing?

I am more than interested in some extra income during these hard times, but I wouldn’t be comfortable with anything other than an adjunct gig if I could ever get one.

[superalj]

After this term of SCOTUS, I am wondering if ALJs will even exist in the near future. I can’t imagine how we will survive with any modicum of judicial independence or retain any sort of for cause protections with this SCOTUS.

Returning back to the subject of the thread, when I was hired, I thought I would be an ALJ until retirement. Sadly, I’m not so sure anymore.

[carrickfergus]

I feel ya. But I think that the forces behind the makeup of new SCOTUS are more interested in whittling down the regulatory agencies, because of the big-money interests at stake. I hope that it may be many years before the Eye of Sauron casts its malevolent gaze in our direction.