Question, Questions, Questions !

[lawcat]

Hey ALJ2009- I'm glad you asked the questions; I was beginning to feel like I was the only one who didn't understand all of the lingo and process for this job. I too am confused about the Certification. How is the decision made about who goes from the register (which I assume everyone who completes the WD and SI will make) to the cert? And are you certified to one agency or all agencies that have ALJ's? Thanks

[emphyrio]

This board has a wealth of information and the answers you are looking for can be found here, but they are a little difficult to tease out because of the way the threads are organized. So here is my own answer to some of your questions (I got hired by SSA in 2008):

-- If you get called for the WD and SI you will eventually make it onto the register with a particular score. The register is compiled by OPM, which does not hire ALJ's. You are not officially told where your score falls on the register, unfortunately, so you just have to compare notes with other board members.

-- As I recall, for this last register we submitted our applications in early May 2007, the WD and SI took place over the summer, and our scores were announced around Halloween. So it took just under six months to go from application to register. I suspect this current round will go slightly faster because OPM now has more recent experience and will operate more efficiently.

-- Once OPM compiles the new register, an agency which wants to hire brand new ALJ's (as opposed to sitting ALJ's) will request a certificate. Each hiring agency gets a separate certificate.

-- In my very humble opinion, it is unlikely that any agencies other than SSA (and possibly Medicare and HUD) will ask for a certificate this time around. Most agencies which employ ALJ's do not seek certificates because they can hire away experienced ones directly from SSA.

-- I do not fully understand the register-to-certificate process, but I think the basic rule is: those three highest scorers for each open position, who have indicated geographic availability for the location of the open position, get on the certificate. So if everyone on the register indicates an availability for Washington DC, and the one position to be filled is in Washington DC, then the top three scorers on the register are placed on the certificate.

-- After the register came out in late October 2007, SSA got a certificate with about 450 names on it and then started interviewing. I was interviewed by SSA in January and the job offers went out in late February. So that process took about four months.

-- SSA wants a substantial number of new hires (I forget the exact number they have announced), but fewer than in 2008. So I suspect the register-to-offer process will go faster this time because there will be fewer interviews.

-- Nobody will contact you if you do not get onto a certificate. You are left completely in the dark about your job prospects. So basically you just wait and hope for the best.

[gadourylaw]

Dear Emphyrio

Thank you for your info. re: the register/cert. process. If you are placed on the cert. for a particular location and are called for an interview, where does that take place, at the ODAR location or do they conduct them in DC (please note, I am not talking about the SI) ?

Sincerely,
Mike G.

[workdrone]

Oct 22, 2008 14:55:13 GMT -5 gadourylaw said:

If you are placed on the cert. for a particular location and are called for an interview, where does that take place, at the ODAR location or do they conduct them in DC (please note, I am not talking about the SI) ?

If I remember correctly, it was done last time at Falls Church. SSA will pay for the trip and they will contact you by e-mail if you are selected for interview to get the process started.

[northwest]

After the expense of 2 plane tickets across the country, it's refreshing to know they won't expect people to go back a third time on our own dimes. If I understand this correctly, if I'm one of the top 3 for any geographic location on my list, the SSA interview would be in Falls Church (a suburb of DC). And there would only be that one SSA interview, regardless of the number of geographic locations I'm being considered for. I assume these interviews will be held in March at the earliest, after the scoring is completed.

[hooligan]

Oct 22, 2008 15:51:34 GMT -5 northwest said:

After the expense of 2 plane tickets across the country, it's refreshing to know they won't expect people to go back a third time on our own dimes. If I understand this correctly, if I'm one of the top 3 for any geographic location on my list, the SSA interview would be in Falls Church (a suburb of DC). And there would only be that one SSA interview, regardless of the number of geographic locations I'm being considered for. I assume these interviews will be held in March at the earliest, after the scoring is completed.

That is not how it works. You are not necessarily in the top three in any location. You are thinking on a micro level and the list is generated on a macro level. In creating a certificate, they decide how many openings they have, mulitply times 3 (with an additional fudge factor) and then take any of the names on the registry willing to go to any location on the certificate down to the lowest score they need to fill the list.

Supposedly, a random list of cities is generated. They look at the top three names on the whole list who have selected the first city. They make a selection and move to the next location. The candidate chosen for City #50 may have been 45th on the list for that city but the higher ranked players were either selected for another city or eliminated by being passed over for three different slots.

[hooligan]

Oct 22, 2008 11:03:47 GMT -5 alj2009 said:

Hi all,

This is my first post, humor me if I mess it up, please!! I am looking for some clarifications of this seemingly Kafka-esque process!

I was lucky enough to get scheduled for the WD and the SI. After that, I'm clueless. I have been reading everything on this and the other board. Even still......

You have a pretty good grasp on the process, including the Kafka reference.

The ALJ selection process is a long, drawn out affair. Many candidates have been attempting to navigate the maze for years. Patience and persistence is the key.

The first and most critical piece of the puzzle is to get as high a score as possible. There are so many applicants bunched so closely together that each fraction of a point can make a huge difference. Once you get a score, you are placed on the Registry. That is just a big list of names ranked according to their score. When an Agency wants to hire, they tap into the Registry. They tell OPM how many they want to hire and where. OPM then generates a list of the highest ranking candidates willing to go to the location of the job(s). That new list is called a Certificate. The hiring agency then uses that Certificate to choose the people they will hire using a process called "The Rule of Three."

The Rule of Three generally provides that the top three candidates are evaluated for each opening. It is not necessary to take the highest scorer, however, if a Veteran with a higher score is passed over to select a non-veteran, the Agency must justify why it feels the Vet was not qualified. The two candidates who were not selected go back into the pool and the process moves to the next city. If a candidate is considered for three locations and not selected, the Agency does not need to consider that candidate for any more locations on that Certificate.

As a practical matter, candidates with the Veteran's Preference tend to be bunched together near the top of the list. The first few locations tend to have Vets competing against Vets. After awhile, the list of Vets is exhaused, either by selection or attrition and the non-vets are left to compete.

This is a good job and it is worth putting up with the process even though it is a bit arcane. Assume nothing and do not give up your day job no matter what your score is until you have your formal offer.

[lawcat]

Thanks everyone for the clarification. One other question: at what point, if any, do the people at the region applied for weigh into the hiring process? Is there any opportunity to know who you'll actually be working with (i.e. the Regional Chief ALJ) or are all of the hiring decisions made in Falls Church?

[aljsouth]

Oct 22, 2008 18:47:14 GMT -5 lawcat said:

Thanks everyone for the clarification. One other question: at what point, if any, do the people at the region applied for weigh into the hiring process? Is there any opportunity to know who you'll actually be working with (i.e. the Regional Chief ALJ) or are all of the hiring decisions made in Falls Church?

Everyone believes hiring decisions are made in Falls Church.

[northwest]

Thanks very much for that explanation. I now understand much better the next stage of the process. And why it would be a bad idea to quit one's job, even with a high score.

[hooligan]

Just one more random piece of information about Agencies other than SSA.

Prior to my selection by SSA, I was put on a certificate for FERC. It was for a single opening in Wash DC. I was able to determine that there were 30 names on the certificate and I was ranked 23rd. Don't assume you will be one of only 3 if you are on a certificate for another Agency.