|
|
Post by meredithcody on Mar 18, 2009 12:37:05 GMT -5
:)Does anyone know if they are going to eventually re-open the initial application or are they going to work off of the existing list?
n:)
|
|
|
|
Post by counsel on Mar 18, 2009 16:46:10 GMT -5
Rumor is the current list, even with the new editions, may not have enough names to meet SSA's hiring needs over the next few years and therefore SSA has asked OPM to reopen to add more more people.
|
|
|
|
Post by pm on Mar 18, 2009 16:49:43 GMT -5
Odds are that ODAR has not asked OPM to reopen. ODAR doesn't even know how many ALJs they will hire next year. The register probably has around 725-775 people which would support hundreds of new hires. "The next few years" don't matter, since OPM will be reopening next year anyway.
|
|
|
|
Post by odarite on Mar 19, 2009 5:53:19 GMT -5
From a recent Commissioner's broadcast:
In anticipation of the surge in disability receipts, in FY 2009, we have already taken preparatory actions to:
-- Hire 157 new ALJs. We also requested OPM to again refresh their ALJ register;
|
|
|
|
Post by jagghagg on Mar 19, 2009 7:02:19 GMT -5
From a recent Commissioner's broadcast: In anticipation of the surge in disability receipts, in FY 2009, we have already taken preparatory actions to: -- Hire 157 new ALJs. We also requested OPM to again refresh their ALJ register; Yeah, 725 people is just not enough for us to chooooose from!! |
|
|
|
Post by pm on Mar 19, 2009 8:46:31 GMT -5
From a recent Commissioner's broadcast: In anticipation of the surge in disability receipts, in FY 2009, we have already taken preparatory actions to: -- Hire 157 new ALJs. We also requested OPM to again refresh their ALJ register; Yes, ODAR did request that OPM refresh the register and OPM did. That's already been discussed here in a different thread. |
|
|
|
Post by traceb on Mar 19, 2009 13:05:52 GMT -5
Am I correct in my understanding that after 2010, if I am not pulled on a register, my name falls off and that I have to start the whole process over again?
|
|
|
|
Post by workdrone on Mar 19, 2009 13:09:33 GMT -5
Am I correct in my understanding that after 2010, if I am not pulled on a register, my name falls off and that I have to start the whole process over again? Yes. You and everyone else from the 2007 and 2009 NORs will have to start the process over again.  |
|
|
|
Post by odarite on Mar 19, 2009 18:55:05 GMT -5
From a recent Commissioner's broadcast: In anticipation of the surge in disability receipts, in FY 2009, we have already taken preparatory actions to: -- Hire 157 new ALJs. We also requested OPM to again refresh their ALJ register; Yes, ODAR did request that OPM refresh the register and OPM did. That's already been discussed here in a different thread. No, not at all. This message from the Commish was March 2. He asked for the register to be refreshed again, after the crop that is on the current register. So not past, but prologue. |
|
|
|
Post by pm on Mar 19, 2009 19:23:54 GMT -5
I know it was March 2. This has been diiscussed in another thread. He was referring to his efforts in getting this register refreshed. Find the other thread and read it.
|
|
|
|
Post by odarite on Mar 20, 2009 5:44:26 GMT -5
You are right the previous discussion took place in a string I did not follow. Having read it, and because the posters there didn't have any better information than the Commissioner's broadcast, I shall continue to respectfully disagree and hold by opinion.
|
|
|
|
Post by pm on Mar 20, 2009 8:49:01 GMT -5
Aside from the actual statement, which seems pretty clear to be plain old bragging, there is no reason of any kind to believe that ODAR has requested even more candidates nor is there any reason to believe that OPM would reopen again this year. You can believe anything you want, but that doesn't substitute for the lack of evidence.
|
|
|
|
Post by oldjag on Mar 20, 2009 9:54:06 GMT -5
A lot depends on when SSA gets a budget for FY 2010. There are only so many time a class can be held, i.e. October-ish and then after winter. If a budget is not in place we get the current situation of trying to jam all the activity in at the end of the FY. This round will take a lot of people off the register, and there are many that will never be considered. This has to be balanced by the HUGE amount of person power need for OPM to reopen the application. If SSA is sure that 200 will be hired FY2010, then the possibility of a reopening this fall increases.
As was said in 'Shakespeare in Love".."I don't know how it happens, it's a mystery".
Good luck to all of you!
|
|
|
|
Post by pm on Mar 20, 2009 18:25:50 GMT -5
ODAR can hire 150 now and there will still be about 600 left on the register. Those 600 can easily support a hire of 150, which leaves 450 on the register and that can easily support a hire of 100. And most of that last 100 will still be in the top half of the current register. So, unless ODAR has immediate plans to hire more than 250 ALJs (after the current presumed hire of 150) by Spring 2010 there will be no need to refresh the regsiter. And even if ODAR tried to get it refreshed, it's no likely OPM would do it since they will start the new register process next spring anyway.
|
|
|
|
Post by dazedandconfused on Mar 21, 2009 9:06:29 GMT -5
PM, I believe your numbers are slightly off. I am an agency person with very good sources. There were over 625 people who made the register in 2007. Approximately 200 were hired by all agencies. This year just north of 550 made the register. It is anticipated 157 will be hired. Throw in another dozen from other agencies like Patriot's Fan, and 170 or so will come off. That still leaves over 800 people on the register this summer. I made the first two certs but was too low to reach. I just missed this cert. I obviously would be reachable if the agency hires 200 next year if OPM does not reopen. Take that into account while I make the following further observations. First, I did hear in the past, and have picked up current rumblings in the present that SSA will ask OPM to again reopen the application process this year. It is not just about numbers; they want more fresh people to pick from. Here are arguments why OPM may not open; first, I have a friend at OPM who absolutely divulges nothing about the methods of scoring, but does say "they hate the ALJ process and would love to get rid of it forever". Second, there are still sufficient names on the register to support 200 more hires next year. This would get OPM through to Oct 2010 when this register ends. If they did reopen, the people in the first two groups had the identical test. If they reopen, many people like myself would retest. Will they give the same questions (AR/WD/SI) again? If so, they have a huge advantage over new test takers; I dont see how that passes legal muster. If they do change questions, you will have a register comprised of people who have had different exams; how is that fair? This would lead to endless litigation. Further, the new testers will only be on the register for less than a year. Also, it forces OPM to re-do the test this year, and then again next year (after Oct 2010). Given how much OPM dislikes this process, and all of the arguments above, I hope when SSA asks for the register to reopen this summer, OPM says, "you have enough qualified people to hire between now and Oct 2010. No new test until after t hat. Just my two cents.
|
|
|
|
Post by okeydokey on Mar 21, 2009 9:48:13 GMT -5
Dazed,
I am interested in the mechanics of how ODAR chooses.
Do they have a set process for putting people on a cert for a specific location?
Do they go down the list and say "ok, here is the top scorer. He did well on the interview. He has chosen locations A to X. Let's put him in location D"?
Or do they divide everyone up by location, 3 per location and make a choice?
Or do they take a specific location, look at the top three candidates for the location and then choose?
Or do they do something else?
It is a bit of a mystery how this is done with 450 candidates and 150 locations.
|
|
|
|
Post by pm on Mar 21, 2009 9:57:28 GMT -5
PM, I believe your numbers are slightly off. I am an agency person with very good sources. There were over 625 people who made the register in 2007. Approximately 200 were hired by all agencies. This year just north of 550 made the register. It is anticipated 157 will be hired. Throw in another dozen from other agencies like Patriot's Fan, and 170 or so will come off. That still leaves over 800 people on the register this summer. I made the first two certs but was too low to reach. I just missed this cert. I obviously would be reachable if the agency hires 200 next year if OPM does not reopen. Take that into account while I make the following further observations. First, I did hear in the past, and have picked up current rumblings in the present that SSA will ask OPM to again reopen the application process this year. It is not just about numbers; they want more fresh people to pick from. Here are arguments why OPM may not open; first, I have a friend at OPM who absolutely divulges nothing about the methods of scoring, but does say "they hate the ALJ process and would love to get rid of it forever". Second, there are still sufficient names on the register to support 200 more hires next year. This would get OPM through to Oct 2010 when this register ends. If they did reopen, the people in the first two groups had the identical test. If they reopen, many people like myself would retest. Will they give the same questions (AR/WD/SI) again? If so, they have a huge advantage over new test takers; I dont see how that passes legal muster. If they do change questions, you will have a register comprised of people who have had different exams; how is that fair? This would lead to endless litigation. Further, the new testers will only be on the register for less than a year. Also, it forces OPM to re-do the test this year, and then again next year (after Oct 2010). Given how much OPM dislikes this process, and all of the arguments above, I hope when SSA asks for the register to reopen this summer, OPM says, "you have enough qualified people to hire between now and Oct 2010. No new test until after t hat. Just my two cents. Thanks for the insight on the register numbers. While those higher numbers are disappointing in one sense, they also make it less likely that ODAR will ask for a new register or that OPM would refresh the register. I really doubt ODAR will ask to reopen this summer. With 800 left, they have no solid argument to support reopening. With that many left, OPM will not at all be open to refreshing just for the sake of refreshing. Also, every time it refreshes, ODAR loses track of where people are on the regsiter. After this next hire, they will have a good idea of where many people are on the register which gives them help in planning future hires. If by "test" you are referring to the WD, OPM told my group that there is more than one WD. That doesn't mean that there is, but if not, adding a new WD would be pretty easy. As for that not being fair, bar exams change every year. That's not unfair. |
|
|
|
Post by pm on Mar 21, 2009 10:00:50 GMT -5
Dazed, I am interested in the mechanics of how ODAR chooses. Do they have a set process for putting people on a cert for a specific location? Do they go down the list and say "ok, here is the top scorer. He did well on the interview. He has chosen locations A to X. Let's put him in location D"? Or do they divide everyone up by location, 3 per location and make a choice? Or do they take a specific location, look at the top three candidates for the location and then choose? Or do they do something else? It is a bit of a mystery how this is done with 450 candidates and 150 locations. ODAR doesn't put anyone on a cert. OPM puts the high scorers on the cert. They is no decsion making involved. The high scorers are listed. As for how ODAR picks people, as soon as they choose a location to fill, they will know the top 3 scorers from the cert at that location and pick one of them. The big question is how ODAR decides to order the locations. |
|
|
|
Post by jagghagg on Mar 21, 2009 10:51:52 GMT -5
Also, every time it refreshes, ODAR loses track of where people are on the regsiter. After this next hire, they will have a good idea of where many people are on the register which gives them help in planning future hires. When things like this are said, by someone who appears to be an insider, it buttresses the oft-repeated admonition that once you are on the Register.... and certainly when you are on the Cert.... scores don't matter. ( Well, they do - just not as much and not in the way a rank score usually matters...) Statements like this are indicative of the fact that ODAR keeps track of who is on the Register and where they are on the Register and they do it because, prior to receiving the Cert, -- heck, prior to requesting it --- they have already identified who they want to hire. |
|
|
|
Post by privateatty on Mar 21, 2009 11:46:00 GMT -5
Pixie told us two years ago that if you got on the Cert, scores didn't matter. That produced a bit of a dustup and she clarified her remarks in her usual poignant style. That thread is worth researching...
|
|
