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Post by Legal Beagle on May 13, 2009 6:53:47 GMT -5
Don't yell at him - such a nice canine avatar. Same thing happened here - called me while I was playing golf. Talk about a heart attack!
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EagleJAG
Full Member
ALJ...a high-G career field worth the fight
Posts: 36
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Post by EagleJAG on May 15, 2009 8:41:52 GMT -5
Based on personal plans to be out-of-country in the May 26th-June 8th time frame, I just called one of the DCHR POCs listed in our March 17th "Notification to ALJ Candidate" email. He was very friendly and open with the game plan.
He indicated that offers would NOT be going out next week, the week of May 18-22. Instead, he said they expected to be making the offers telephonically the week of Memorial Day (May 25th). With Memorial Day being a federal holiday, that means the phone calls will be made the week of May 26-29.
I know no one enjoys the wait, but it looks like we'll all need to muster another 11 or so days of patience.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2009 8:55:51 GMT -5
No. I refuse to believe it. I...am...in...denial.
Can anyone verify this? Google? Pix? Anyone.
At this point just give me a different answer, even if it's wrong...
R
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Post by ssaer on May 15, 2009 8:59:55 GMT -5
It's difficult to believe that individuals would be asked to close their practices and reorient their lives with a lead time of just 3 weeks, half the time that was afforded selectees in the prior hiring round.
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Post by lawandorder on May 15, 2009 9:55:06 GMT -5
Well, all circumstantial evidence, based on last year's time frame, indicated that offers should be out anytime from May 18 to May 22, 2009. If new ALJs must report to their duty stations by June 22, offers will be made before May 22. Remember, throughout this waiting period, we've heard so many different dates from so many different people, including people from ODAR. So my bet is on or before May 22.
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Post by grford on May 15, 2009 10:02:52 GMT -5
I have heard the May 26th date from several good sources.
Remember, the ALJ training is in either July or August for this hiring. If an individual cannot close up shop by the June 22 date, they will be placed in the August class and not have to report for duty until mid-July.
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Post by tallgreenfrog on May 15, 2009 10:05:29 GMT -5
You are betting on a date before May 22 when EagleJAG was told by people hiring us that it would be the following week? I belive you, EagleJAG.
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Post by privateatty on May 15, 2009 10:09:01 GMT -5
It's difficult to believe that individuals would be asked to close their practices and reorient their lives with a lead time of just 3 weeks, half the time that was afforded selectees in the prior hiring round. I think a good argument can be made that if you are so lucky as to be selected, you can ask for a later class. DRs require that you ensure your client's case is not prejudiced by your withdrawal. In some cases a continuance would be a real hardship and an improper instance of putting you before your client.
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Post by carjack on May 15, 2009 11:02:56 GMT -5
Circumstances may also require the court's permission to withdraw and trying to get substitute counsel. Some attorneys also work under contract which may have specific requirements in them as well.
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on May 15, 2009 15:08:39 GMT -5
Because I'm still somewhat in denial on when we will hear about job offers, I wrote some polite e-mails to SSA HR and the OCALJ.
I asked about when we might hear something and how we would be notified. I was advised:
"We hope to be able to make offers at the end of May, first of June."
"The candidates will likely hear from Personnel by early June."
No additional info was provided on the method of communication of those offers.
R.
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Post by privateatty on May 15, 2009 15:39:47 GMT -5
Because I'm still somewhat in denial on when we will hear about job offers, I wrote some polite e-mails to SSA HR and the OCALJ. I asked about when we might hear something and how we would be notified. I was advised: "We hope to be able to make offers at the end of May, first of June." "The candidates will likely hear from Personnel by early June." No additional info was provided on the method of communication of those offers. R. Don't anybody call or email. They may say the middle of June. My relatives/friends keep calling and asking when I'm gonna hear. Telling them I'm dealing with the Federal Government is all I've been able to come up with.
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Post by morgullord on May 15, 2009 15:40:31 GMT -5
With the Memorial Day weekend coming relatively early, it is reasonable that ODAR would wait until after the holiday.
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Post by Orly on May 15, 2009 15:49:50 GMT -5
With the Memorial Day weekend coming relatively early, it is reasonable that ODAR would wait until after the holiday. The problem really isn't when the offers are going out. It's all about managing expectations. If they told everyone all up front that it's going to be second week of June and then got it done a week early, I think most people would have been very happy. It's when they first told people 5/11 during interviews, then it became 5/18 or 5/22, and now going into late May or early June, that's when people start to get stressed out and frustrated. It's like the finishing line getting moved back 50 yards multiple times during a marathon, each time just when you thought you're about to finish. I know the agency is under a lot of time pressure and staff are doing the best they can, but still, under promising and over delivering is much more preferable than the current situation.
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Post by morgullord on May 15, 2009 16:36:23 GMT -5
I am not making a value judgement.
Remember the Pennsylvania Dutch saying; the hurrier I go, the behinder I get.
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Post by ssaer on May 15, 2009 16:46:00 GMT -5
The problem really isn't when the offers are going out. It's all about managing expectations. If they told everyone all up front that it's going to be second week of June and then got it done a week early, I think most people would have been very happy. It's when they first told people 5/11 during interviews, then it became 5/18 or 5/22, and now going into late May or early June, that's when people start to get stressed out and frustrated. It's like the finishing line getting moved back 50 yards multiple times during a marathon, each time just when you thought you're about to finish. I know the agency is under a lot of time pressure and staff are doing the best they can, but still, under promising and over delivering is much more preferable than the current situation. It's not just a matter of "managing expectations." It's also the fact that three weeks is simply an unreasonably short period in which to require that those selected wrap up their current duties and commence the process of starting a new life in a new location. Where is the time for selling one's house and finding a new one, for example? Each one of us is not merely an ALJ-in-waiting; we also have families, relationships, commitments and responsibilities that will require significant adjustment. Three weeks can pass no one's test of reasonableness, and will likely lead to an increased rate of declinations and a significant degree of resentment on the part of many unless, of course, the Agency moves back the start date for the first group of trainees.
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Post by Orly on May 15, 2009 16:52:40 GMT -5
It's also the fact that three weeks is simply an unreasonably short period in which to require that those selected wrap up their current duties and commence the process of starting a new life in a new location. Where is the time for selling one's house and finding a new one, for example? Each one of us is not merely an ALJ-in-waiting; we also have families, relationships, commitments and responsibilities that will require significant adjustment. Three weeks can pass no one's test of reasonableness, and will likely lead to an increased rate of declinations and a significant degree of resentment on the part of many. Touche. It is definitely a hardship for people who have those issues. Not everyone can pull up stakes and leave at the drop of a hat. Very good point.
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Post by roggenbier on May 15, 2009 17:40:20 GMT -5
If this pattern continues, it may be a race between those ALJ candidates collecting Social Security and ALJ candidates still of working age.
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Post by puravida on May 15, 2009 17:56:44 GMT -5
Forget relocation, finding new schools in unknown locales, comforting distressed children who are being uprooted, and terminating other associations and obligations. It is plenty difficult for any responsible person to wrap up pending cases, have matters reassigned, and train people to assume duties in a few weeks. One thing about the feds, though, is that 2 weeks (or less) is normal notice. Do you keep up your pace at work and then walk out on your responsibilities, or do you start to wind down on the 1 out of 3 chance you'll get an offer? After all, we can't all request deferred hiring dates, can we? Now that's a thought.....
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Post by inquisitive on May 15, 2009 20:45:53 GMT -5
There are a number of things that may have forced the SSA to move back the date it plans to extend the 157 ALJ job offers. For instance, we know that someone was calling ALJ candidates' professional references this morning to pose clarifying questions. If the background checks have not been completed then it makes sense that the SSA cannot move forward and start selecting those to whom it will extend offers.
Moreover, it is possible that someone important outside of the SSA has posed probing questions to the SSA about its ALJ selection and hiring practices. If you'll recall, some Forum members have raised serious questions as to whether or not the SSA's ALJ selection and hiring process runs afoul of merit system principles. Certainly enough time has now lapsed since the February 26, 2008 ALJ offers were extended that important people may have caught wind of the surrounding controversy. Those important people could be folks from OPM that have a statutory and regulatory duty to protect the merit system principles. Or those important people could be members of Congress.
There can be little doubt that if someone from OPM or Congress has made inquiries of the SSA about its ALJ selection and hiring process then the forthcoming offers could be pushed back to the end of May or even sometime in June 2009. And in the worst case scenario OPM could recall or cancel the March 2009 certificate of ALJ eligibles. Attached to SSA ALJ Wenzel's February 2009 declaration was a copy of an OPM letter to the SSA from around a decade ago wherein OPM recalled or canceled a certificate of ALJ eligibles that OPM had previously issued to the SSA.
But for those Forum members that are current SSA employees whose GAL included an ODAR Hearing Office in your present city of residence, the delay may bode extremely well for you. If the SSA doesn't push back the June 22 report date for the first one-half of the new hires, then the SSA may be inclined to extend ALJ offers to candidates that already reside in the city where the ALJ slot is to be filled. Moreover, the SSA certainly knows that the ALJ candidates not presently employed by the SSA in the city where the ALJ slot is to be filled would be hard pressed to enter on duty (EOD) as a SSA ALJ on Sunday, June 21, 2009, with an initial report date of Monday, June 22, 2009.
And since someone inquired, in February 2008 the SSA extended 144 ALJ job offers. Per information previously released by the SSA, there were precisely 11 declinations. My math indicates that this declination percentage was less than 10 percent.
I have no reliable information as to the declination percentage associated with the ALJ job offers extended off of the second certificate of ALJ eligibles (and the associated supplement) later in 2008.
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Post by lawandorder on May 15, 2009 22:36:52 GMT -5
Because I'm still somewhat in denial on when we will hear about job offers, I wrote some polite e-mails to SSA HR and the OCALJ. I asked about when we might hear something and how we would be notified. I was advised: "We hope to be able to make offers at the end of May, first of June." "The candidates will likely hear from Personnel by early June." No additional info was provided on the method of communication of those offers. R. Don't anybody call or email. They may say the middle of June. My relatives/friends keep calling and asking when I'm gonna hear. Telling them I'm dealing with the Federal Government is all I've been able to come up with. This is wise advise. I don't want to hear that June 15 will be d-day.
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