Here's something new to think about.....

[aljsouth]

julie said:

My score was 76.09. I selected almost all (112) locations. I don't speak Spanish, so did not choose PR or Florida. I also opted out of some of the major metropolitan areas (e.g., NYC, LA, etc).

Surely you didn't exclude all the Florida sites because you didn't speak Spanish. While there is a large and long established latino community in Tampa, you don't have to speak spanish to be a judge there. Ditto Orlando. In Jacksonville it is even less important. Really Dallas or Houston or San Antonioare little different than Tampa from this point.

In any case, I do applaud you willingness to try new places. It makes a difference in being selected or not for most people.

[morgullord]

No one gets Puerto Rico unless they are fluent in Spanish, both speaking and reading.

[morgullord]

It was said elsewhere that people on the register will be contacted to verify their city choices; I do not think this will be so. Under the old register, people often waited years before being contacted. We listed our cities back in May. ODAR may choose to treat them as current choices. If that is the case, refusing an offer for a particular site may be the equivalent of pulling the trigger on yourself for this go-round.

[southerner]

I agree with m'lord. There is too much to be done to go back to asking if cities chosen were still okay. They might ask during interview process to confirm offers or site selection, but I think that is most they will do.

[jagghagg]

So - if I am not mistaken - this would all mean that the answer to jobane's question ("Then, if one has selected ALL is there a way not to be considered for places such as the far north without turning down an offer after an interview?") would be "no." (?)

[Pixie]

In the past OHA/ODAR would send something in the mail asking which locations the candidate was still interested in. This allowed the agency to eliminate individuals from consideration who would no longer accept an appointment to a particular location. It saved time for the agency and dealt no penalty to the candidate. Whether that procedure will be followed this time, I don't know, but imagine that it will be. Pix.

[snowman]

If those who limited their geographic choices are now stuck with them, it seems that those who made expansive choices should be stuck with them. Due to personal circumstances, I had to restrict my geographical location. Now, six months from the date the open period closed, those circumstances have changed, but I have no recourse. It is unfortunate that OPM or SSA can't send out the list closer to the time they will interview.

[sta]

While costs were mentioned as a pivotal factor in city location, another consideration of possible equal importance is the amount of travel required at the assigned city. Particularly in the west, it is not uncommon to have to travel one week a month or even every other week. So you might want to look into this leading up to a decision.

[kingfisher]

snowman said:

If those who limited their geographic choices are now stuck with them, it seems that those who made expansive choices should be stuck with them. Due to personal circumstances, I had to restrict my geographical location. Now, six months from the date the open period closed, those circumstances have changed, but I have no recourse. It is unfortunate that OPM or SSA can't send out the list closer to the time they will interview.

As Pixie said above, when SSA is about to hire they ask candidates to confirm locations they will accept.

In my case, I was given the opportunity by SSA, not OPM, to submit a new Geographic Preference form and was instructed to include Only those locations that I would definitely accept.

When the offer came in, I was told that I was being offered a position and I had three days to accept. There was no time to bargain for a different location or ask if I could have another city.

[lee]

sta & others who are insiders---
I thought that the travel issue was a good point, and one which I had not considered. Outside of the West and very large cities, what is the travel schedule for most ALJs and how wide ranging is that travel. I assume that each office covers a designated area.
Thanks for any information.

[chris]

snowman said:

If those who limited their geographic choices are now stuck with them, it seems that those who made expansive choices should be stuck with them. Due to personal circumstances, I had to restrict my geographical location. Now, six months from the date the open period closed, those circumstances have changed, but I have no recourse. It is unfortunate that OPM or SSA can't send out the list closer to the time they will interview.

While I agree with you personally, it looks like SSA can probably ask people if they want to informally decline a city or cities without going through the offer process. On the other hand, I don't see any way SSA can add a city. I wish they could.

[jobane]

That would be certainly nice to know-- before one is fortunate enough to arrive at the final interview whether one will after moving one's family to a new place and then having to arrange to travel 200+ miles out to a field office a week or more out of every month- especially in the cold snowy months in the more rural states. Any way to check that out?

[morgullord]

This is not a 100% accurate way to figure out how much travel you will be doing but this will give you some information:

Go to www.ssa.gov
Click on More Disability Information (center column, under Disability & SSI)
Click on Hearings and Appeals (left column, near the bottom of the page)
Click on Locate a Hearing Office (left column)
Click on “ODAR Hearing Office Locator” (left column)
Click on the State where the Hearing Office that you want to check is located.
Click on the Hearing Office that you want to check.
Look at the service locations listed; then do some map-work with a road atlas, etc.
The locations listed do not all have remote hearing capability; however, you can
Do “worst case” scenarios.
Note that service locations often cross State lines.

My Hearing Office has three remote hearing sites. Two of them are close enough that the judge can sleep at home every night if he so chooses while holding hearings there. The third site usually means overnight travel. Our judges rarely spend more than three days there every other month. Remember that you will be competing with other judges for very limited facilities at a remote site. The travel is likely to be less burdensome than feared.

[morgullord]

Has anyone else thought of this? OPM permitted 600 to sit for the WD and SI. What are the chances that SSA will take one certificate with all 600 names? This would give SSA the greatest flexibility in filling vacant judge slots in the no-tree states.

[learnedhand]

In order to do that, SSA would have to request a certificate for 200 openings.

[aaa]

My office is in the midwest. We have 7 remote hearing sites (no permanent remote sites, so most hearings are in hotel conference rooms). ALJs travel at least one week a month by car - furtherest site is about 3 hours away and snow/ice are factors in the winter - sometimes highways shut down. Most travel cases are still paper cases.

As for me, score is 75.75 and I limited geographical area to 4 offices, two region 4, one region 6, one region 7.

[tdtksbp]

I have selected all and would be excited to go someplace new. I am single and have no family ties to limit any move. However, my score is only 61 plus, so there is very little chance that will happen this time around.

[counselor95]

With the short time frame, I think there will be no opportunity to update our geographical preferences. And, just because the rules this time say that one can decline the first offered position, does not mean that a second position will be offered. Personally, I would be very hesitant to decline any offer.

[chris]

That is a very good point. If ODAR likes you but is struggling with whether they like you enough to give you a city you listed over someone else who listed the same city, then they give you the offer and you turn down that city, they may not exert as much effort to place you elsewhere.

[Pixie]

If you turn down an offer for one location, it is unlikely that you will get an offer for another location for that class.

The offers will go out by telephone with the initial calls being made on the same day. When someone accepts, that location is eliminated from the list. If the person to whom the offer is made declines the offer, the next person on the list is contacted and offered the position.

A candidate's name is given to ODAR personnel for one location as number one on the list for that location--say location A. She is not listed as number one for location A, number two for location F, and number three for locations M, N and O. Although I suppose Falls Church could play it that way to reach a favorite, but that isn't the normal method of doing business. Don't count on being a favorite.

To the ones making the selection, the names are anonymous and fungible. If one falls, then move to the next one. Normally, maybe 90% accept the offer, and there is no need to go to number two on the list. If you get the offer, don't turn it down. Pix.