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Post by privateatty on May 27, 2015 18:09:44 GMT -5
Pumpkin - I, too, was using an AOL e-mail address before while I was awaiting the 2nd stage invite which never came, and I did check my inbox and spam folder every day. Although after I discovered that there was a problem, I changed my e-mail address from AOL to Gmail in USA Jobs (almost two years ago now), and had sent my appeal correspondence from Gmail (with reference to the AOL address), the invite I received on 5/18 came on my AOL account. My appeal response on 5/22 arrived on my Gmail account. Like you, when I responded to the survey, since it had been sent via AOL I changed the address there to Gmail too. The 'paranoia' I've referred to in past posts includes wondering if I possibly could have mistyped my Gmail address. I don't think I did but I sure wish I could double-check. Ah well! I will wait until shortly after June 2 and watch this forum, and if I learn that others are getting more details and I am not, I'll just have to contact OPM. You can lie awake at night and worry this thing to your early demise. You did it right. I got hacked with an AOL account and switched to gmail. It all happened in the midst of applying for a job I became convinced (after two years) that I would never get. The next year I got hired. The path is seldom linear and never like anything you have known. You have to do the forms, show up and have faith. The rest is up to a higher power--and it ain't OPM.
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Post by JudgeRatty on May 27, 2015 18:34:38 GMT -5
Pumpkin - I, too, was using an AOL e-mail address before while I was awaiting the 2nd stage invite which never came, and I did check my inbox and spam folder every day. Although after I discovered that there was a problem, I changed my e-mail address from AOL to Gmail in USA Jobs (almost two years ago now), and had sent my appeal correspondence from Gmail (with reference to the AOL address), the invite I received on 5/18 came on my AOL account. My appeal response on 5/22 arrived on my Gmail account. Like you, when I responded to the survey, since it had been sent via AOL I changed the address there to Gmail too. The 'paranoia' I've referred to in past posts includes wondering if I possibly could have mistyped my Gmail address. I don't think I did but I sure wish I could double-check. Ah well! I will wait until shortly after June 2 and watch this forum, and if I learn that others are getting more details and I am not, I'll just have to contact OPM. You can lie awake at night and worry this thing to your early demise. You did it right. I got hacked with an AOL account and switched to gmail. It all happened in the midst of applying for a job I became convinced (after two years) that I would never get. The next year I got hired. The path is seldom linear and never like anything you have known. You have to do the forms, show up and have faith. The rest is up to a higher power--and it ain't OPM. THIS. Sage advice folks. Everyone jumps and starts getting all excited the minute anyone hears any news whatsoever, but things don't happen all at the same time for ALL of us, as there are so many processes going on at the same time here. We have hiring from the current register, transfers, news of allowing some to advance to the next step for some of those who were cut at step 2, some (I think 2 so far or 3) who were cut at step 1 get to move on, and more. All of this is happening at the same time.
It does not mean anyone is being jilted because ALL did not get notice of the appeal decision at the exact same time. They are clearly working the appeals and giving notice to some, but look at who got that notice so far.... a very simple situation where it was an email error. So I think we all need to chill a bit, give it some more time (yes I know it has been 2 years ... I applied in March 2013 too ) and have a little faith. There are only so many things that OPM can do at a time. Sending "mass" emails as someone suggested is not going to happen. Each appeal is different and entails different issues, not to mention different levels. So keep the faith, keep watching the board for news, and cheer each other on as we all run this super ultramarathon. Good luck to all!
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Post by gary on May 27, 2015 19:08:52 GMT -5
You can lie awake at night and worry this thing to your early demise. You did it right. I got hacked with an AOL account and switched to gmail. It all happened in the midst of applying for a job I became convinced (after two years) that I would never get. The next year I got hired. The path is seldom linear and never like anything you have known. You have to do the forms, show up and have faith. The rest is up to a higher power--and it ain't OPM. THIS. Sage advice folks. Everyone jumps and starts getting all excited the minute anyone hears any news whatsoever, but things don't happen all at the same time for ALL of us, as there are so many processes going on at the same time here. We have hiring from the current register, transfers, news of allowing some to advance to the next step for some of those who were cut at step 2, some (I think 2 so far or 3) who were cut at step 1 get to move on, and more. All of this is happening at the same time.
It does not mean anyone is being jilted because ALL did not get notice of the appeal decision at the exact same time. They are clearly working the appeals and giving notice to some, but look at who got that notice so far.... a very simple situation where it was an email error. So I think we all need to chill a bit, give it some more time (yes I know it has been 2 years ... I applied in March 2013 too ) and have a little faith. There are only so many things that OPM can do at a time. Sending "mass" emails as someone suggested is not going to happen. Each appeal is different and entails different issues, not to mention different levels. So keep the faith, keep watching the board for news, and cheer each other on as we all run this super ultramarathon. Good luck to all!
Sigh! I long for the days when it was just a marathon, not a sprint.
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Post by JudgeRatty on May 27, 2015 19:23:52 GMT -5
This whole new register process changed the rules man. Super ultra now. Marathon was apparently not enough.
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Post by hopingforalj on May 27, 2015 19:40:06 GMT -5
You know Sratty, I tell time like an old lawyer, because to me when i tell a client we will be at a hearing in 18 to 22 months and i say, "thats not a long time" i have come to believe it, this process for me is like a case going from hearing to App Council to Federal Court, a short 3 or 4 years. I know time will pass and if they start over fresh in 2019 in the hiring process, then 2019 will be here before we all know it. . P.S. I use to think waiting on grades in law school was a long time, I'm not sure when i began to judge time like an old lawyer of which i am becoming.
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Post by JudgeRatty on May 27, 2015 20:24:42 GMT -5
You know Sratty, I tell time like an old lawyer, because to me when i tell a client we will be at a hearing in 18 to 22 months and i say, "thats not a long time" i have come to believe it, this process for me is like a case going from hearing to App Council to Federal Court, a short 3 or 4 years. I know time will pass and if they start over fresh in 2019 in the hiring process, then 2019 will be here before we all know it. . P.S. I use to think waiting on grades in law school was a long time, I'm not sure when i began to judge time like an old lawyer of which i am becoming. You nailed it. Got that right! Seriously, it's hard when you are not in the front car. Those who were chosen at the onset, in the first class, they had it easy so to speak. They only waited from March 2013 to August 2014. Not so bad. But everyone who waits beyond that has to have a bit of a longevity gut. And then there are those who are in the pool of "and oh by the way" we have shifted the 2nd level tier to a new threshold, and guess what... you are still in the game! Yeah, those folks are in for an even longer wait but hey, at least there is a CHANCE again. Then, add to that the folks that have appeals pending with zero word, nothing to compare it to since this is all a new game to us and add in their frustration. Yep... the whole thing reeks of "patience" and we all get sick to death of hearing all that. But just think .... those people who are waiting for a disability decision wait too. And this is nothing. At least we all have jobs, and we are just looking for a better opportunity. It's all about the view.
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Post by Gaidin on May 27, 2015 21:48:10 GMT -5
Sigh! I long for the days when it was just a marathon, not a sprint. Amen
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Post by 71stretch on May 27, 2015 22:03:40 GMT -5
You know Sratty, I tell time like an old lawyer, because to me when i tell a client we will be at a hearing in 18 to 22 months and i say, "thats not a long time" i have come to believe it, this process for me is like a case going from hearing to App Council to Federal Court, a short 3 or 4 years. I know time will pass and if they start over fresh in 2019 in the hiring process, then 2019 will be here before we all know it. . P.S. I use to think waiting on grades in law school was a long time, I'm not sure when i began to judge time like an old lawyer of which i am becoming. You nailed it. Got that right! Seriously, it's hard when you are not in the front car. Those who were chosen at the onset, in the first class, they had it easy so to speak. They only waited from March 2013 to August 2014. Not so bad. But everyone who waits beyond that has to have a bit of a longevity gut. And then there are those who are in the pool of "and oh by the way" we have shifted the 2nd level tier to a new threshold, and guess what... you are still in the game! Yeah, those folks are in for an even longer wait but hey, at least there is a CHANCE again. Then, add to that the folks that have appeals pending with zero word, nothing to compare it to since this is all a new game to us and add in their frustration. Yep... the whole thing reeks of "patience" and we all get sick to death of hearing all that. But just think .... those people who are waiting for a disability decision wait too. And this is nothing. At least we all have jobs, and we are just looking for a better opportunity. It's all about the view. Oh, grasshopper, you forget those who have been in this hunt since the old register was created in 2007... Or the refresh in 2009. Still a marathon.
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Post by bookman on May 27, 2015 23:27:06 GMT -5
Heard from a friend, his online test was somehow lost in email, he is getting another chance to take it... a great person who really deserves the break
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Post by moopigsdad on May 28, 2015 6:53:45 GMT -5
You know Sratty, I tell time like an old lawyer, because to me when i tell a client we will be at a hearing in 18 to 22 months and i say, "thats not a long time" i have come to believe it, this process for me is like a case going from hearing to App Council to Federal Court, a short 3 or 4 years. I know time will pass and if they start over fresh in 2019 in the hiring process, then 2019 will be here before we all know it. . P.S. I use to think waiting on grades in law school was a long time, I'm not sure when i began to judge time like an old lawyer of which i am becoming. You nailed it. Got that right! Seriously, it's hard when you are not in the front car. Those who were chosen at the onset, in the first class, they had it easy so to speak. They only waited from March 2013 to August 2014. Not so bad. But everyone who waits beyond that has to have a bit of a longevity gut. And then there are those who are in the pool of "and oh by the way" we have shifted the 2nd level tier to a new threshold, and guess what... you are still in the game! Yeah, those folks are in for an even longer wait but hey, at least there is a CHANCE again. Then, add to that the folks that have appeals pending with zero word, nothing to compare it to since this is all a new game to us and add in their frustration. Yep... the whole thing reeks of "patience" and we all get sick to death of hearing all that. But just think .... those people who are waiting for a disability decision wait too. And this is nothing. At least we all have jobs, and we are just looking for a better opportunity. It's all about the view. I think hopingforalj and sratty are dead on here. There is nothing to compare this present OPM process to any past history. It is different than anything in the past. It looks like the easiest appeals to process for OPM are those where the candidates "supposedly" did not receive the email to take the second part of the examination online. It seems those are easiest to fix and get those candidates to move on. How many candidates are in that situation I do not know, but I can guess it isn't more than a few hundred. Then, I suppose OPM will move on and choose another easy fix like did someone have the requisite 7 years of legal practice. I think contrary to what OPM stated in their email about all appeals will be decided at one time, OPM will be processing those appeals in small sections. The other thing to remember for all as hopingforalj, sratty, 71stretch and others have stated in posts, just getting on the Register and even interviewing doesn't guarantee you a position. The whole process requires patience. I think in today's world everyone wants a quick answer and decision. This isn't going to happen in this process as many have found out. Just bide your time and proceed with your life as if nothing was going to happen. If something does happen in your favor you can thank your lucky stars and if it doesn't you still have your normal life to continue. Best luck to all waiting for appeals, offers, etc. Just don't let the thought of what may or may not happen consume every waking moment for you.
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Post by Gaidin on May 28, 2015 9:12:26 GMT -5
So this appears to be the first we've heard that OPM has issued a Notice of Appeal Results. Congrats on that. Gives appellants hope that more determinations should be coming at some point (near or far in the future, who knows?). Not sure in what order they are providing these or how long a wait people will have, but at least there are some decisions being made on appeals. In its appeal rights email, OPM said: "After all appeals have been adjudicated, applicants will be notified via email of the Panel’s decision."This looks like it would mean everybody will be getting their Notice of Appeal Results emails in short order. It will be interesting to see how it actually plays out. In re-reading parts of this thread I realized nothing about the statement above indicates that notification about appeals will be simultaneous or evenly proximately close in time. I was re-reading the thread because it occurs to me that Hope2B's and Pumpkin's appeals weren't granted they were mooted. OPM decided that everybody above a certain cut off score (which now will include a lower scored subgroup) will be given the opportunity to retest. That isn't granting any appeals that is saying the appeals are moot because circumstances have changed. They may have sent an appeals results email but that is premised on the fact that the appeal is resolved not because they have ruled on the appeal. I think anybody worrying about getting notice that the WD/SI invites have gone out and they missed it again should stay tuned to this channel because I can promise you people will announce it here. Finally, I noticed several people upset that application manager is down and they couldn't monitor the appeals status. What on Earth makes you think they would let you know the status of any appeal until they were ready to send you and email telling you what it is. That is just asking for emails and phone calls about status changes that would only slow the processing of appeals down.
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Post by mamaru on May 28, 2015 9:49:09 GMT -5
Well, I feel vindicated! And, as dumb as this may sound, I sincerely wanted all of you to be the first to know. At 4:04 p.m. Eastern today, I got an e-mail entitled "Notification of Appeal Results." If you've read my previous posts you'll recall I absolutely did not receive my 2nd round invitation in 2013 & by the time I found out about it, it was too late. (Actually, I found this forum on May 14, and immediately appealed since I learned that others were already into the 2nd round. The ALJ Office did not respond until June 18 with its statement that I'd been sent the invite and had had a deadline of May 10. So, my appeal was dated June 18, 2013.) At any rate, the "Appeal Status" is "Resolved in your favor," with the explanation, "OPM has determined that it cannot readily demonstrate in all instances that the message that OPM attempted to transmit to applicants to commence the Online Component actually reached their destinations." My relief is that "described in the ALJ Applicant Update Survey that you were sent on May 18, 2015," namely, "an opportunity to be re-scheduled and to take the three Online Component assessments of the 2013 ALJ examination." The e-mail went on, "OPM will also provide information and notices regarding the ALJ examination to interested parties, as appropriate. As such information becomes available, it will be posted on the OPM ALJ website at www.opm.gov/services-for-agencies/administrative-law-judges/." Regardless of everything, and regardless of all the reasons which may be behind this, my opinion of OPM has increased exponentially. I can only hope this long wait is worth it and that I am lucky enough to move through all the stages successfully -- and, relatively speaking, quickly! My sincere thanks to all of you on this forum who have given me information, guidance and encouragement. This looks to me like resolution of an appeal.
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Post by Gaidin on May 28, 2015 10:10:02 GMT -5
Resolution does not equal adjudication.
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Post by moopigsdad on May 28, 2015 10:25:30 GMT -5
Gaidin I don't disagree with your assessment about OPM and the appeals. I just think the highlighted sentence was poorly written.
In its appeal rights email, OPM said:
"After all appeals have been adjudicated, applicants will be notified via email of the Panel’s decision."
It probably should have read after each appeal has been adjudicated, the applicant will be notified via email of the Panel's decision. The above highlighted sentence could be read to indicate only after all appeals are decided that applicants would be notified. It more than likely means (as you interpret) that applicants will be notified by the Panel after adjudication of his/her appeal.
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Post by ibnlurkin on May 28, 2015 10:39:48 GMT -5
Gaidin I don't disagree with your assessment about OPM and the appeals. I just think the highlighted sentence was poorly written. In its appeal rights email, OPM said: " After all appeals have been adjudicated, applicants will be notified via email of the Panel’s decision." It probably should have read after each appeal has been adjudicated, the applicant will be notified via email of the Panel's decision. The above highlighted sentence could be read to indicate only after all appeals are decided that applicants would be notified. It more than likely means (as you interpret) that applicants will be notified by the Panel after adjudication of his/her appeal. I'm going to go out on a limb and say I think we've spent far more time and thought interpreting that phrase than they did composing it.
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Post by gary on May 28, 2015 10:45:07 GMT -5
Gaidin I don't disagree with your assessment about OPM and the appeals. I just think the highlighted sentence was poorly written. In its appeal rights email, OPM said: " After all appeals have been adjudicated, applicants will be notified via email of the Panel’s decision." It probably should have read after each appeal has been adjudicated, the applicant will be notified via email of the Panel's decision. The above highlighted sentence could be read to indicate only after all appeals are decided that applicants would be notified. It more than likely means (as you interpret) that applicants will be notified by the Panel after adjudication of his/her appeal. I'm going to go out on a limb and say I think we've spent far more time and thought interpreting that phrase than they did composing it.
The best description of a lawyer at work I've seen in a long time.
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Post by funkyodar on May 28, 2015 12:35:38 GMT -5
In its appeal rights email, OPM said: "After all appeals have been adjudicated, applicants will be notified via email of the Panel’s decision."This looks like it would mean everybody will be getting their Notice of Appeal Results emails in short order. It will be interesting to see how it actually plays out. In re-reading parts of this thread I realized nothing about the statement above indicates that notification about appeals will be simultaneous or evenly proximately close in time. I was re-reading the thread because it occurs to me that Hope2B's and Pumpkin's appeals weren't granted they were mooted. OPM decided that everybody above a certain cut off score (which now will include a lower scored subgroup) will be given the opportunity to retest. That isn't granting any appeals that is saying the appeals are moot because circumstances have changed. They may have sent an appeals results email but that is premised on the fact that the appeal is resolved not because they have ruled on the appeal. I think anybody worrying about getting notice that the WD/SI invites have gone out and they missed it again should stay tuned to this channel because I can promise you people will announce it here. Finally, I noticed several people upset that application manager is down and they couldn't monitor the appeals status. What on Earth makes you think they would let you know the status of any appeal until they were ready to send you and email telling you what it is. That is just asking for emails and phone calls about status changes that would only slow the processing of appeals down. I'm going to throw a little fuel on the fire I guess. It is important to note the distinct difference in the two groups that these recent announcements have impacted. One group consists of those that took the step 2 online tests and were previously told they did not place within the "higher scored subgroup" that would be invited to DC. OPM has now stated they intend to lower the bar on that component and thereby let more folks that were previously cut through to the DC testing phase. For that group, and with that action, I agree with Gaidan that OPM has thusly "mooted" any appeals filed by those they ultimately let through with the lowered bar. No adjudication of any specific appeal has or will occur. To my knowledge though, OPM has not yet sent any info to anyone in this group advising them they are now invited to DC. That is still to come. The second group consists of those, like hopetobealj, that passed phase 1 but never logged in to take phase 2 due to some email snafu or technical glitch. These people are not in the same boat as those that took the tests at phase 2 and didnt pass previously. But, they are not either in the same boat as those that were cut at phase 1. OPM has, apparently as a result of an MPSB complaint and ruling, decided to afford those in this situation and opportunity to take the online tests. Some of those folks may never have appealed. Some, like HopetoB did. In that case, it certainly appears to me that their appeal has been granted in light of the fact that one can assume the basis of the appeal was that they never got the link or had some technical glitch for which OPM was at fault. This current action by OPM certainly seems to acknowledge that fault and offer a remedial measure. So, those that took the test and are now possibly getting to move on after lowering the bar....I don't see how that action or group can be seen as being the result of any appeal. Thus, no basis of compalint by anyone upset that their appeal hasnt been handled despite being told all appeals would disposed of at the same time. That second group though....certainly looks to me like their appeals were adjudicated in their favor and they were apprised of those results before everyone else's appeal was decided in contradiction to OPM's stated plan. But, I don't think OPM deciding on a new manner and method of handling appeals, in and of itself, gives rise to any due process complaint. Just my own humble opinion.
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Post by mamaru on May 28, 2015 13:49:41 GMT -5
Funky said what I meant about the hope2 group.
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Post by moopigsdad on May 28, 2015 13:53:29 GMT -5
A very well thought-out and illuminative discussion of the subject funkyodar, but what else should we expect from a sitting ALJ and excellent Board member? I think you are correct completely in your discussion of the matter. Thank you for taking the time to say it all much better than I could have hoped to do.
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Post by keepsake on May 28, 2015 14:00:52 GMT -5
I agree that the Notification of Appeal Results that Hope2be got looks an awful lot like a formal determination of some sort of his appeal (if not an outright adjudication) and not simply a "you may pass on to the next stage" because of the mootness of the appeal.
Indeed, when I write an order dismissing something as "moot" - I certainly do not engage in the kind of "merits" based discussion that resolves something in a party's "favor". But - whatever - people have to, and will continue to have to, wait from word from OPM at all different stages of this process over which applicants have no control and precious little information. Thus - I think the scrutiny with which any kind of communication from OPM results.
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