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Post by Deleted on Apr 17, 2008 11:30:23 GMT -5
Please see the e-mail I received from OPM regarding my appeal. The core of my argument was that I met the qualifications to apply, so I should have been given the opportunity to interview and compete and be scored with everyone else. Obviously, the argument was wasted. On the whole, I have to say the response was very unsatisfying. Certainly there were no details of which I was not already aware. It's basically a form rejection of appeal letter with no analysis. Oh well. I suppose I will know better next time that the key to the hiring process is the wording of your AR responses. Also, please note the comment on veteran's preference. It WAS considered in determining who was the most qualified. Oh, really? How so? If I had been selected, wouldn't you just have to consider it...again? So it factors twice? I have to say the OPM process is really just impenetrable from the outside. Best wishes to all and here's looking forward to the next opening...whenever that will be! RobG This message serves as official notification of the results of your appeals request, which has been adjudicated by the Administrative Law Judge (ALJ) Appeals Panel (Panel). The Panel has evaluated your case and all relevant documentation and has decided to sustain your original “ineligible†Notice of Results (NOR) as described below: IAR: Your Accomplishment Record (AR) score was not among the highest group of all eligible applicants. Accordingly, your application will no longer be considered for the current ALJ examination. As provided in the Administrative Law Judge (ALJ) vacancy announcement (2007ALJ – 134575), your AR score must have been among the highest group from all eligible applicants in order for you to be invited to participate in the Written Demonstration and the Structured Interview. Note: In determining the highest group of AR scores, veterans’ preference was considered for applicants who were entitled to veterans’ preference and had submitted the required documentation. As indicated in the ALJ Appeal Rights message you received with your NOR, the Panel adjudicated your appeal based on the record (i.e., only that information submitted as part of your online application process for the ALJ vacancy announcement that closed May 9, 2007). The Panel reviewed all six of your AR competency narratives and confirmed that both your original AR score and associated IAR NOR were appropriate. As described in the ALJ Appeal Rights message you received with your NOR, the decision of the Panel is final and exhausts your appeal rights with regard to this appeal. You may retake the ALJ Examination when the examination is open to the receipt of new applications. OPM plans to reopen the ALJ examination as the need arises. You will be required to complete all parts of the examination at that time. Specific application information and filing procedures will be described in the ALJ vacancy announcement. You may find out about future open periods by referring to OPM’s website at www.usajobs.opm.gov. Thank you for your continued interest in the ALJ Program. Respectfully, Administrative Law Judge Examining Office |
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Post by arlene25 on Apr 17, 2008 13:24:21 GMT -5
Robg, I agree--the answer really said nothing. Best of luck with your next app. A25
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Post by nonamouse on Apr 17, 2008 13:51:30 GMT -5
I've heard some internal rumblings that OPM may be getting ready to repost the job announcement after this next certificate is done. I don't know how reliable that info is at this point. However, it would make sense that OPM would send out the appeal denials and then avert any lawsuits by merely allowing everyone to reapply. It would end up being right about one year from the last application period if the new cert comes out before the end of this month and then they repost the job. Of course I'm trying to apply logic to an illogical process.
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Post by justbob on Apr 17, 2008 14:05:35 GMT -5
And I was worrying my appeal did not get the careful individual attention it deserved: This message serves as official notification of the results of your appeals request, which has been adjudicated by the Administrative Law Judge (ALJ) Appeals Panel (Panel).
The Panel has evaluated your case and all relevant documentation and has decided to sustain your original “ineligible” Notice of Results (NOR) as described below:Too damn funny! In the nearly-a-year since I initially applied, I've realized things were just going too well in my life, that I don't need to put myself in the position where some anonymous bureaucrat can tell me that the past 20+ years of my career don't render me minimally qualified to interview for this position. Congrats to everyone who was selected, and good luck to everyone who chooses to bang their head against this wall again. Me? I'll be on the golf course!  |
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Post by nonamouse on Apr 17, 2008 15:53:41 GMT -5
why even review appeals if OPM is going to reopen the announcement? the fact that OPM is deciding the appeals leads me to believe that they wont reopen the announcement until next year. I hate to sound the cynic, but honestly how much "review" do we think was really done? Everyone I've heard of got the same canned response about the same time. My advice to everyone is to get their materials ready and make sure that usajobs will email the opening when it is posted. I personally will be looking for that happy day in order to expand my list of cities if this next cert does not do it for me. |
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Post by morgullord on Apr 18, 2008 9:36:53 GMT -5
This is what I think I know: SSA is king of the canned response (see POMS); however, SSA employees take their work seriously and are, by and large, desirous of reaching the right decision. POMS uses a decision-tree format that generates a letter with almost all canned language. I think it is safe to assume that OPM workers are equally dedicated but they must follow their rules of engagement. Therefore, even though the denial notice in effect told you nothing specific, I think that appellants' applications are reviewed according to the procedures and guidelines set up by OPM. I think they use a score-sheet with an "if-then" format. I know this is not what anyone might want to hear but it is how I think things work after 33 years of working for various levels of government.
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Post by zero on Apr 21, 2008 10:49:45 GMT -5
I got exactly the same response a couple of days ago. How can OPM confirm that my AR was not among the highest group of all eligible applicants by ONLY reviewing my application materials? Wouldn't you need to compare the application materials to the materials of the highest group?
If you carefully read what they wrote, OPM didn't look at whether your score was assigned appropriately (zero in my case) but whether the score was high. It took them 10 months to confirm that zero is not a very high number.
I’m not sure I agree with the other posters that OPM is getting ready to go out for another round. Why would it put itself through another round if it has plenty of names from the last list?
Anyway, congrats again to those who survived and advanced.
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Post by lostagain on Apr 22, 2008 9:00:21 GMT -5
Issuing rejections is consistent with an intent to reopen the register. After all, reopening the register would, in large part, moot the rejections. Also, if it reopens the regsiter in the near future, OPM will not have to retest alll those on the current register who wish to imprive their scores.
Moreover, OPM will be motivated to reopen the register soon because, depending on the geographical choices of the persons who are now on the register, if an agency tried to do a mass hire in FY 2009 (as SSA has claimed it intends to), OPM might be unable to produce a certificate that includes three persons for each position.
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Post by nonamouse on Apr 22, 2008 10:32:37 GMT -5
Issuing rejections is consistent with an intent to reopen the register. After all, reopening the register would, in large part, moot the rejections. Also, if it reopens the regsiter in the near future, OPM will not have to retest alll those on the current register who wish to imprive their scores. Moreover, OPM will be motivated to reopen the register soon because, depending on the geographical choices of the persons who are now on the register, if an agency tried to do a mass hire in FY 2009 (as SSA has claimed it intends to), OPM might be unable to produce a certificate that includes three persons for each position. your response doesnt make any sense. if reopening the register moots all the appeals, then why decide the appeals if opm is going to reopen the register in the near future. opm would most likely let the appeals sit undecided and reopen the register. Re-posting the job for new applications does not actually moot the appeals, but for practical purposes if someone really wants the job then they are likely to apply again. OPM can then count on dealing with the majority of people who appealed as new applicants rather than as appellants filing at district court. OPM sent the denials because they must follow the regs and formally deal with each appeal administratively. I do have to disagree with something that lostagain said with regards to people already on the register. If someone on the register wants to improve their score, then they would have to reapply and take their chances on going to the WD & SI again. They could end up with a higher or lower score than the one currently on the register. The only thing that the reposting of the position would do for those already on the register until 2010 (or whenever OPM decides to start a completely new one) is allow them to add cities to their availability list without going through the whole application/test/interview process again. |
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Post by zero on Apr 22, 2008 11:58:08 GMT -5
I'll bet a buck three fifty that OPM will take at least one more year from today to post again.
In retrospect, if they would only improve the transparency and provide real explanations for the rejections, I believe they would have cut down on the push-back from the applicants.
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Post by lostagain on Apr 22, 2008 13:07:18 GMT -5
I do have to disagree with something that lostagain said with regards to people already on the register. If someone on the register wants to improve their score, then they would have to reapply and take their chances on going to the WD & SI again. They could end up with a higher or lower score than the one currently on the register. I recall reading -- but I'm not certain -- that those on the regsiter can reapply one year after their scores were released. Thus, if the register was reopened and closed less that one year after that, those on the currently on it could not retest. Update: I checked my OPM emails and one included the following. "Retaking the ALJ Examination: If you received a NOR with a final numerical rating, you may retake the examination after one year has passed from the date of the final NOR and the examination opens to the receipt of new applications." NORs were issued on October 30th. Thus, it seems that, if OPM reopens the register before October 30, 2008, those currently on it will not be able to retest. |
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Post by lostagain on Apr 22, 2008 13:31:47 GMT -5
Re-posting the job for new applications does not actually moot the appeals, but for practical purposes if someone really wants the job then they are likely to apply again. OPM can then count on dealing with the majority of people who appealed as new applicants rather than as appellants filing at district court. OPM sent the denials because they must follow the regs and formally deal with each appeal administratively. Nonamouse has accurately stated what I unsuccessfully tried to communicate. To put it in a nutshell, denying the appeals and then allowing the appellants to test goes a long way to making the denial "appeal proof." At regulatory agencies, this practice takes the form of enforcement orders in which an agency finds violations but imposes no penalty (or penalties that are very light) so that appealing the decisions fails cost/benefit analysis. |
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Post by morgullord on Apr 22, 2008 14:04:47 GMT -5
May 1, 2010.
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Post by zero on Apr 22, 2008 15:38:52 GMT -5
How long did it take last time? Oh wait, there was a lawsuit pending. Oh wait, there's a lawsuit pending again. I'll bet a buck three fifty that OPM will take at least one more year from today to post again. In retrospect, if they would only improve the transparency and provide real explanations for the rejections, I believe they would have cut down on the push-back from the applicants. this would make a good poll/board contest: "What date will OPM reopen the ALJ application process?" |
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Post by 24kgoldengirl on May 30, 2008 21:13:21 GMT -5
I appealed my score. Suffice it to say, somebody had to be last. I have not heard a peep on my appeal. Do you think ODAR lost my email address. Should I be doing something (besides looking for another line of work)?
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Post by tdtksbp on May 30, 2008 21:35:40 GMT -5
Has anyone received a decision on their appeal in which the appeal did not involve the applicant not making the initial cut and getting to the WD and SI?
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Post by dazedandconfused on May 31, 2008 8:26:41 GMT -5
tdksbp: I too filed a merit appeal and have not heard anything. As people seem to report hearing in batches, I am guessing we are not alone. I am holding out little hope of any real change in my score. There is no real explanation as to why this appeal should take so long. One possible theory: the Chief Judge has recently been touring ODAR offices around the country. I heard him state that the hiring goals for next year and the year after will still be 100-150 ALJs each year. With those kinds of numbers to fill, they will need to reopen the register to new applicants. If they stall this long enough (after Oct 30) those with merit appeals who reapplied would give up their appeal. As most would pick that route, it would make the need to review the merit appeals moot. Just one theory.
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Post by nyctourist on May 31, 2008 19:00:32 GMT -5
I have had an udpate on my merit appeal on my score. I scored just high enough to make the first cert, but not high enough for the second. After not being hired, I sent a request for an update. I pretty much argued to OPM that I was entitled to know why I scored so poorly since that rating basically cost me my opportunity. I was (and still am) pretty sure my references checked out, and my interview at SSA went OK. I got back a response that they had many appeals to evaluate, and they would get to me in due course, or something to that effect. So game's still on for what ever that matters.
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Post by tdtksbp on May 31, 2008 23:19:54 GMT -5
Thanks for the information. I guess as with everything else in this process, it is a waiting game. Since there is no other choice, all we can do it wait for them to rule on the appeal or reopen for us to try to improve our scores that way.
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Post by anotheroldtimer on Jun 2, 2008 13:34:47 GMT -5
During the just completed training the Deputy Commissioner stated that the agency had filed a request with OPM for them to reopen the register.
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