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Post by beenlurking on Mar 18, 2014 13:35:03 GMT -5
I too was one who did not get a minimum score on the WD. I am also a 10 pointer. Any thoughts out there on appealing vs. re-applying?
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Post by FlaTreeFarm on Mar 18, 2014 13:38:07 GMT -5
I too was one who did not get a minimum score on the WD. I am also a 10 pointer. Any thoughts out there on appealing vs. re-applying? I've seen other more experienced posters opine that if you have the option to re-apply, that is far quicker than waiting for an appeal result, and probably has a better chance of success, now that you have experience!
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Post by Gaidin on Mar 18, 2014 13:40:21 GMT -5
If I was a 10 pointer there is no way I would wait for the appeals process to play out. There are reports on the Board of people waiting over a year for appeal results with no guarantee of getting favorable results.
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Post by beenlurking on Mar 18, 2014 13:41:53 GMT -5
Actually, I got cut on phase I because I did not put the month and year with my experience. The decision was easier then because I knew that re-applying would be faster. Now, however, I'm not so sure since testing has finished.
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Post by FlaTreeFarm on Mar 18, 2014 13:44:18 GMT -5
Actually, I got cut on phase I because I did not put the month and year with my experience. The decision was easier then because I knew that re-applying would be faster. Now, however, I'm not so sure since testing has finished. I think they are required to give you a result no later than the quarter after you re-apply, so that will likely be quicker! See ALJ Hiring FAQ Part 1.
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Post by papresqr on Mar 18, 2014 13:45:32 GMT -5
Can you do both at the same time? Anybody? If so, you can appeal and reapply while you're waiting. If you pass the second time around and get on the register, you could withdraw your appeal. Yes, it would involve going through the whole process again, but might be worth it.
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Post by papresqr on Mar 18, 2014 13:47:23 GMT -5
Actually, I got cut on phase I because I did not put the month and year with my experience. The decision was easier then because I knew that re-applying would be faster. Now, however, I'm not so sure since testing has finished. Knowing this, I would definitely reapply. If you win your appeal months down the road, you would still have to go through the rest of the process anyway. So you're not losing anything at all by re-applying.
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Post by 71stretch on Mar 18, 2014 13:49:21 GMT -5
Actually, I got cut on phase I because I did not put the month and year with my experience. The decision was easier then because I knew that re-applying would be faster. Now, however, I'm not so sure since testing has finished. If you reapplied right away, are you done with the testing?
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Post by beenlurking on Mar 18, 2014 14:00:11 GMT -5
Earlier, at phase I reject, I appealed. When I requested for the closed exam to be re-opened I was informed that if I re-applied I would forfeit my appeal. It was a no-brainer then. Now, after being denied by not having minimum score on WD (which, like others, I thought I did really well on) and spending the money/time on testing in DC, the decision isn't as easy.
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Post by papresqr on Mar 18, 2014 14:16:09 GMT -5
Ah, I misunderstood. I didn't go back to your original post to see that you did go through the whole testing process. Guess that answers my question as to whether you could reapply and appeal at the same time.
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2014 14:19:57 GMT -5
Earlier, at phase I reject, I appealed. When I requested for the closed exam to be re-opened I was informed that if I re-applied I would forfeit my appeal. It was a no-brainer then. Now, after being denied by not having minimum score on WD (which, like others, I thought I did really well on) and spending the money/time on testing in DC, the decision isn't as easy. I'm a 10 pointer also and if I were in your position, I would re-apply vs. appeal. You could get on the register a lot quicker and if they are hiring another big class in FY 15, you would be there vs. waiting for an answer. The D.C. trip is the only cost and it's not that bad for an Attorney.
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Post by futuressaalj on Mar 18, 2014 14:21:52 GMT -5
Earlier, at phase I reject, I appealed. When I requested for the closed exam to be re-opened I was informed that if I re-applied I would forfeit my appeal. It was a no-brainer then. Now, after being denied by not having minimum score on WD (which, like others, I thought I did really well on) and spending the money/time on testing in DC, the decision isn't as easy. beenlurking, this is an easy decision unless you are in the poor house an cannot afford a trip to DC. PM if you need a recommendation for a hotel that will cost you really cheap. Be grateful that you can re-apply, it is a reward for your service to our country and most folks that were cut wish they had the option. You also have the benefit of having had a trial run under your belt. Obviously you need to look at your WD approach but if I were you I would be sending in my request to test again today, forget this appeal route it could take a year or longer and in that time frame you could be wearing your robe if the re-test goes well, especially since I know you will list all 170+ cities on your GAL this second time around. Also, lets say you win the appeal and wind up with a 65 in the end? Nope send that e-mail asking for the re-test ASAP.
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Post by beenlurking on Mar 18, 2014 15:14:01 GMT -5
Believe me, I am grateful that I have the option. It's just like many others, I have written decisions for ODAR, trial briefs, appellate briefs, etc..for years and I really thought my WD was pretty darn good. For that reason, I almost feel like I want another "set of eyes" laid on it to see if someone dropped the ball the first time. Or, perhaps, to get some kind of feedback.
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Post by beenlurking on Mar 18, 2014 15:14:19 GMT -5
Believe me, I am grateful that I have the option. It's just like many others, I have written decisions for ODAR, trial briefs, appellate briefs, etc..for years and I really thought my WD was pretty darn good. For that reason, I almost feel like I want another "set of eyes" laid on it to see if someone dropped the ball the first time. Or, perhaps, to get some kind of feedback.
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Post by beenlurking on Mar 18, 2014 15:14:39 GMT -5
Sorry for double post!
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Post by JudgeRatty on Mar 18, 2014 15:26:52 GMT -5
I do not think that being DQ'd due a less than minimum score on the WD has much bearing on your ability to write well. Instead, it may be that others simply had an even better response, that something extra. If the population on this board is any indication, there are many high achievers and over achievers, with incredible experience and skill. As for those who are lucky enough to have a score, but who are not happy with their score...keep in mind that the polls here may be skewed a bit higher. I know it has been said on other threads, but I agree with the contention that the folks on this board make up a higher scoring range of individuals in general. Those who seek out and research before applying, and those who have been watching this position for a while, would be better prepared for the process in general IMHO. My bet is that there are many with lower scores than reported who will either not post if they are on the board, but even more who have never heard of this board. Good luck to all who appeal!
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Post by Deleted on Mar 18, 2014 16:22:02 GMT -5
Believe me, I am grateful that I have the option. It's just like many others, I have written decisions for ODAR, trial briefs, appellate briefs, etc..for years and I really thought my WD was pretty darn good. For that reason, I almost feel like I want another "set of eyes" laid on it to see if someone dropped the ball the first time. Or, perhaps, to get some kind of feedback. I get what you are saying, but if it takes over a year to get a response from the appeal, you will have missed the Certs for 100+ hires while waiting for that "set of eyes", but good luck with whatever you decide.
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Post by beenlurking on Mar 18, 2014 16:52:10 GMT -5
Thanks for all the responses.
As much as I've read on this board regarding the lengthy appeal process, I've also heard from my time with SSA of some successful appeals. I guess it just is all a big crap shoot.
SRATTY, I agree that there certainly are some talented people on this board and probably a lot more so than me. However, I've also heard and/or read that one person moving on and another not could be the result of different folks at OPM looking at different candidates. Put a different way, the luck of the draw. We just don't know.
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Post by papresqr on Mar 18, 2014 16:55:01 GMT -5
I do not think that being DQ'd due a less than minimum score on the WD has much bearing on your ability to write well. Instead, it may be that others simply had an even better response, that something extra. If the population on this board is any indication, there are many high achievers and over achievers, with incredible experience and skill. Believe me, I understand your point, and would agree with the proposition that even if you are a great writer, there will always be someone, or even many people, who wrote a better decision than you. However, it was my understanding that there is a minimum passing score, not that there are a minimum number of people who will pass. If there is a "minimum score" to pass, then it should not matter if your writing was the worst of the bunch, as long as you made that minimum passing score. You're being compared to a standard, not against the other test takers. I think that's where those of us who did not pass are having the issue. If you write for a living, your writing has always been considered excellent, and you felt really good about how you did, it's hard to swallow that you didn't even make a minimum score.
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Post by JudgeRatty on Mar 18, 2014 16:57:21 GMT -5
Thanks for all the responses. As much as I've read on this board regarding the lengthy appeal process, I've also heard from my time with SSA of some successful appeals. I guess it just is all a big crap shoot. SRATTY, I agree that there certainly are some talented people on this board and probably a lot more so than me. However, I've also heard and/or read that one person moving on and another not could be the result of different folks at OPM looking at different candidates. Put a different way, the luck of the draw. We just don't know. So true on the luck of the draw part. My point was that no one should feel "lesser than" simply due to scoring (or not scoring) lower than anticipated when we are in a high talent pool. And I know of several who have had successful appeals and who are now called Judge. they said it took years but it eventually happened.
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