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Post by SPN Lifer on Nov 5, 2020 19:01:19 GMT -5
Got a 15 during the application process; the major impact of that was that my GAL went from small to tiny. Even so I really had to think carefully about whether to make the jump. But very glad I did, ALJ has been significantly superior with respect to quality of life. I do miss the writing and legal analysis from my old job but it was a good tradeoff. Very accurate assessment. There are both pluses and minuses in each position. Issues percolated more and needed more deliberation and someone else made the decision in my past GS-15 job. I did learn a great deal with every issue that was complicated.
In the ALJ job. I am the decision maker. I get maybe three hours per case and I need to move them ASAP.
I can still take time off whenever I need to but now I need to plan out well in advance because of hearing schedule which is usually planned out six months in advance. At the old job, I could just take off at a moment's notice. Can still do it as an ALJ but only on non-hearing days and also cannot just take a week unless I have planned it out six months in advance!
I did not have to sign in at my old job. I came and went as I pleased, there was no one watching me, after all my GS grade was at top of the food chain. I am still at the top of the food chain as an ALJ but I have to sign in and out every day and account for any time that I am not actively engaged--so there is some micro managing in the ALJ job. Not that there is any time to loiter with the amount of cases that you are required to handle on a monthly basis.
As a GS-15 I had some weeks that were slow and I caught up on projects. There is no such thing as a slow week as an ALJ, even if you are not doing hearings you are catching up on other work, prepping for cases, writing instructions, editing decisions etc..
Overall it is a good job. I took it because I got a location where I always wanted to be. If you are a GS-15 in a location you are happy with, then do not take the job at a location you know nothing about. You may come to second guess your decision on a daily basis because there is a huge change in the type of work you will do and there is also a culture shock when you come to SSA.
Two points: (1) I have never found it realistic to take a day off when I wanted, even on non hearing days. On those days, I mainly am preparing for hearings the next day. If I take off, I go into hearings the next day unprepared, and I won't do that. That means every weekday of my life for the next 5 to 6 months is accounted for. There is no flexibility, and for no good reason. At least I usually get the weekends off. Could never be assured of that luxury prior to joining the Agency. (2) it is to our benefit to sign in and sign out. In my past life I, too, was never required to do that. Usually worked 50 to 60 hours a week. When I started with the Agency we had the option of signing in or not. I quickly learned the benefits of using the sign in sheet and never opted for the alternative. I think I knew of one judge who opted to not sign in. YMMV. Pixie (1) If I am going to take a day off, I do prepare ahead of time for the hearings. Last week my spouse had a medical procedure that came up at last minute so I just stayed longer an prepped for the cases that I would have prepped for on that day--I do not take days off just to take days off--but there are times when the need does come up. (2) I am still doing the 50 hours a week on average that I did when I was a GS-15, it just comes with the territory. One thing I found very difficult was the ability to use up the credit hours. But I hope to get better. Especially once I start teleworking. This is great question and one I get from friends and colleagues who know I'm pursuing the ALJ path (currently on register with fingers crossed like many of us). I am a GS-15 non-supervisory attorney in a litigation position who was previously a GS-14 supervisory attorney in a non-litigation position. For me, my motivation is first and foremost LOCATION. The ALJ route is one of the few paths for me to remain a federal attorney at a high pay rate outside the high-cost mega markets of DC, NYC, Chicago, etc. The ALJ path gives my family and I a chance to relocate closer to family, reduce our cost of living, and improve our quality of life (shorter commutes, less rat race, etc.). Other factors for me: 1) chance for more independence 2) opportunity to serve as a judge and be a decision maker in an important process for my fellow citizens 3) increase my high three for retirement purposes 4) positive experiences of friends and mentors who are currently ALJs 5) professional doors that may open for post-federal retirement jobs (I'm particularly interested in getting into academia, the non-profit world, or state/local government) 6) chance to mentor folks like the decision writers, attorney advisers, etc. on their legal careers EXACTLY. 8 months after transitioning from basically a GS-15 federal litigation job (AFPD) to ALJ - this has been my exact experience. I tell everyone who asks - this is the BEST job I have ever had. I sincerely hope you get the joy of moving to this job. Good luck! I was a GS-15 (supervisory) for 12 years before getting the call. Among the best things about this ALJ job is NOT SUPERVISING OR MANAGING! It is so rare and refreshing to have senior-level federal legal work without having to spend most of my time on budgets, personnel, and (worst of all), sailing between Scylla and Charybdis from the Washington political appointees without getting eaten. This is the best job I ever had, even without the privilege of not supervising or managing, but that is a great icing on the cake! I was a GS-15 for a long time with the feds before becoming an ALJ. My decision to become an ALJ was not financial. It was based on 1) mobility. I had none in my previous job. 2) interest in the type of work I would be doing as an ALJ. 3) several years of problematic management (being an attorney does not necessarily make you a good manager), with no indications that anything would improve and 4) a desire to try something different. Very glad I gave it a go. As to the GS-15s deciding that they don't want the job because they have it really good, well, they have never had a job without a supervisor, an annual review, worries about behavior that they can't control, etc. The only thing I can compare it to in terms of the incredible freedom of being an ALJ is leaving the Army. No more phone slips, imploring emails, working through my "vacations" (hah!), stupid, nasty clients, rapacious opposing counsel, constant, unrelenting worry. Becoming an ALJ changed my life in ways you would not believe. Suddenly, I had TIME. Time for my daughter, wife and friends. Time to smell the roses and look at my life and what had run through my hands. I'm gonna keep this job as long as I can--God willing, maybe even into my 80s. I have no retirement plan and frankly, don't want one. I like where I work, with whom I work, those before whom I work and the law I am constantly learning. I work with smart, funny people who care about me. Imagine that. I'm still pinching myself after nine years on the job and eleven on this Board. Two years later, this remains valuable information for what ALJ positions are available. |
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Post by hopefalj on Nov 5, 2020 19:28:42 GMT -5
Nice compilation!
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Post by Pixie on Nov 5, 2020 19:33:12 GMT -5
He's a wizard at that sort of thing. Pixie |
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Post by rp on Nov 5, 2020 20:36:05 GMT -5
Got a 15 during the application process; the major impact of that was that my GAL went from small to tiny. Even so I really had to think carefully about whether to make the jump. But very glad I did, ALJ has been significantly superior with respect to quality of life. I do miss the writing and legal analysis from my old job but it was a good tradeoff. Very accurate assessment. There are both pluses and minuses in each position. Issues percolated more and needed more deliberation and someone else made the decision in my past GS-15 job. I did learn a great deal with every issue that was complicated.
In the ALJ job. I am the decision maker. I get maybe three hours per case and I need to move them ASAP.
I can still take time off whenever I need to but now I need to plan out well in advance because of hearing schedule which is usually planned out six months in advance. At the old job, I could just take off at a moment's notice. Can still do it as an ALJ but only on non-hearing days and also cannot just take a week unless I have planned it out six months in advance!
I did not have to sign in at my old job. I came and went as I pleased, there was no one watching me, after all my GS grade was at top of the food chain. I am still at the top of the food chain as an ALJ but I have to sign in and out every day and account for any time that I am not actively engaged--so there is some micro managing in the ALJ job. Not that there is any time to loiter with the amount of cases that you are required to handle on a monthly basis.
As a GS-15 I had some weeks that were slow and I caught up on projects. There is no such thing as a slow week as an ALJ, even if you are not doing hearings you are catching up on other work, prepping for cases, writing instructions, editing decisions etc..
Overall it is a good job. I took it because I got a location where I always wanted to be. If you are a GS-15 in a location you are happy with, then do not take the job at a location you know nothing about. You may come to second guess your decision on a daily basis because there is a huge change in the type of work you will do and there is also a culture shock when you come to SSA.
Two points: (1) I have never found it realistic to take a day off when I wanted, even on non hearing days. On those days, I mainly am preparing for hearings the next day. If I take off, I go into hearings the next day unprepared, and I won't do that. That means every weekday of my life for the next 5 to 6 months is accounted for. There is no flexibility, and for no good reason. At least I usually get the weekends off. Could never be assured of that luxury prior to joining the Agency. (2) it is to our benefit to sign in and sign out. In my past life I, too, was never required to do that. Usually worked 50 to 60 hours a week. When I started with the Agency we had the option of signing in or not. I quickly learned the benefits of using the sign in sheet and never opted for the alternative. I think I knew of one judge who opted to not sign in. YMMV. Pixie (1) If I am going to take a day off, I do prepare ahead of time for the hearings. Last week my spouse had a medical procedure that came up at last minute so I just stayed longer an prepped for the cases that I would have prepped for on that day--I do not take days off just to take days off--but there are times when the need does come up. (2) I am still doing the 50 hours a week on average that I did when I was a GS-15, it just comes with the territory. One thing I found very difficult was the ability to use up the credit hours. But I hope to get better. Especially once I start teleworking. This is great question and one I get from friends and colleagues who know I'm pursuing the ALJ path (currently on register with fingers crossed like many of us). I am a GS-15 non-supervisory attorney in a litigation position who was previously a GS-14 supervisory attorney in a non-litigation position. For me, my motivation is first and foremost LOCATION. The ALJ route is one of the few paths for me to remain a federal attorney at a high pay rate outside the high-cost mega markets of DC, NYC, Chicago, etc. The ALJ path gives my family and I a chance to relocate closer to family, reduce our cost of living, and improve our quality of life (shorter commutes, less rat race, etc.). Other factors for me: 1) chance for more independence 2) opportunity to serve as a judge and be a decision maker in an important process for my fellow citizens 3) increase my high three for retirement purposes 4) positive experiences of friends and mentors who are currently ALJs 5) professional doors that may open for post-federal retirement jobs (I'm particularly interested in getting into academia, the non-profit world, or state/local government) 6) chance to mentor folks like the decision writers, attorney advisers, etc. on their legal careers EXACTLY. 8 months after transitioning from basically a GS-15 federal litigation job (AFPD) to ALJ - this has been my exact experience. I tell everyone who asks - this is the BEST job I have ever had. I sincerely hope you get the joy of moving to this job. Good luck! I was a GS-15 (supervisory) for 12 years before getting the call. Among the best things about this ALJ job is NOT SUPERVISING OR MANAGING! It is so rare and refreshing to have senior-level federal legal work without having to spend most of my time on budgets, personnel, and (worst of all), sailing between Scylla and Charybdis from the Washington political appointees without getting eaten. This is the best job I ever had, even without the privilege of not supervising or managing, but that is a great icing on the cake! I was a GS-15 for a long time with the feds before becoming an ALJ. My decision to become an ALJ was not financial. It was based on 1) mobility. I had none in my previous job. 2) interest in the type of work I would be doing as an ALJ. 3) several years of problematic management (being an attorney does not necessarily make you a good manager), with no indications that anything would improve and 4) a desire to try something different. Very glad I gave it a go. As to the GS-15s deciding that they don't want the job because they have it really good, well, they have never had a job without a supervisor, an annual review, worries about behavior that they can't control, etc. The only thing I can compare it to in terms of the incredible freedom of being an ALJ is leaving the Army. No more phone slips, imploring emails, working through my "vacations" (hah!), stupid, nasty clients, rapacious opposing counsel, constant, unrelenting worry. Becoming an ALJ changed my life in ways you would not believe. Suddenly, I had TIME. Time for my daughter, wife and friends. Time to smell the roses and look at my life and what had run through my hands. I'm gonna keep this job as long as I can--God willing, maybe even into my 80s. I have no retirement plan and frankly, don't want one. I like where I work, with whom I work, those before whom I work and the law I am constantly learning. I work with smart, funny people who care about me. Imagine that. I'm still pinching myself after nine years on the job and eleven on this Board. Two years later, this remains valuable information for what ALJ positions are available. Update: Now 3 years (really?) later....Still the BEST JOB EVER. |
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Post by intothewild on Nov 5, 2020 22:50:20 GMT -5
I’m not an ALJ, but one thing I’m not liking from what I hear is the micro management. I don’t want to clock in and clock out like a teenager working at Sears.
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Post by rp on Nov 5, 2020 22:54:32 GMT -5
I’m not an ALJ, but one thing I’m not liking from what I hear is the micro management. I don’t want to clock in and clock out like a teenager working at Sears. Not my experience at all. My HOCALJ, the rest of management, and everyone else in the HO are consummate professionals. We collaborate, do our job, and enjoy our work. YMMV. |
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Post by Ace Midnight on Nov 6, 2020 7:38:11 GMT -5
I've been extremely fortunate to have worked with outstanding folks, including managers, during my entire time in ODAR/OHO (with one notable exception).
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Post by FrogEsq on Nov 6, 2020 9:52:13 GMT -5
At first, I found the sign in/out personally annoying. But, the fact was, I had stopped working 8 hour days long before becoming an ALJ (Old career 9-11 hours/OD required)and I signed in every day, electronically with my key card. And, luckily, after a few months, I forgot to be pissed about signing in. LOL
I can also say that folks I have met(i.e HOCALJs; HODs) went/go out of their way NOT to micro manage me.
FYI- I have never been in a 'bad' office [ knock on wood; salt over my shoulder; lit a candle)
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Post by christina on Nov 6, 2020 10:35:27 GMT -5
I’m not an ALJ, but one thing I’m not liking from what I hear is the micro management. I don’t want to clock in and clock out like a teenager working at Sears. Not my experience at all. My HOCALJ, the rest of management, and everyone else in the HO are consummate professionals. We collaborate, do our job, and enjoy our work. YMMV. Mileage def varies. Glad yours has been awesome. |
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Post by intothewild on Nov 6, 2020 11:51:43 GMT -5
I’m not an ALJ, but one thing I’m not liking from what I hear is the micro management. I don’t want to clock in and clock out like a teenager working at Sears. Not my experience at all. My HOCALJ, the rest of management, and everyone else in the HO are consummate professionals. We collaborate, do our job, and enjoy our work. YMMV. Well I’m glad to hear that. I just worry when I hear about the micro management. I like being somewhat free to do my work without being bothered. |
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Post by Mister Atkins on Nov 6, 2020 13:14:01 GMT -5
I’m not an ALJ, but one thing I’m not liking from what I hear is the micro management. I don’t want to clock in and clock out like a teenager working at Sears. Not my experience at all. My HOCALJ, the rest of management, and everyone else in the HO are consummate professionals. We collaborate, do our job, and enjoy our work. YMMV. Micro what? Sure, I log in and check into web ta, but it is NOTHING like tracking billables by the .10 or .15. I move my work hours around to suit me, with very mild exceptions of having to complete those hours between 0630 and 6:00pm. Not exactly onerous. Sure, I have to schedule 50 hearings to keep telework, and I have to keep cases moving, but tell me where you can work, even for yourself where you don't have deadlines? No one bothers me. I do my work, and I enjoy my job. If I have a question, I have plenty of people to serve as sounding boards and back stops, but no one telling me how to decide. I truly hope your mileage isn't varying much from mine. |
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Post by aljhopefully on Nov 6, 2020 13:16:47 GMT -5
I’m not an ALJ, but one thing I’m not liking from what I hear is the micro management. I don’t want to clock in and clock out like a teenager working at Sears. Not my experience at all. My HOCALJ, the rest of management, and everyone else in the HO are consummate professionals. We collaborate, do our job, and enjoy our work. YMMV. Hey rp, when you applied to be an ALJ how did they view your AFPD experience? I'm also an AFPD, but since law school I've wanted to be an ALJ. I ladder up to the equivalent of GS-15, but no supervision. |
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Post by rp on Nov 6, 2020 13:21:36 GMT -5
Not my experience at all. My HOCALJ, the rest of management, and everyone else in the HO are consummate professionals. We collaborate, do our job, and enjoy our work. YMMV. Micro what? Sure, I log in and check into web ta, but it is NOTHING like tracking billables by the .10 or .15. I move my work hours around to suit me, with very mild exceptions of having to complete those hours between 0630 and 6:00pm. Not exactly onerous. Sure, I have to schedule 50 hearings to keep telework, and I have to keep cases moving, but tell me where you can work, even for yourself where you don't have deadlines? No one bothers me. I do my work, and I enjoy my job. If I have a question, I have plenty of people to serve as sounding boards and back stops, but no one telling me how to decide. I truly hope your mileage isn't varying much from mine. Preach! Miss you, Mister Atkins! |
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Post by rp on Nov 6, 2020 13:43:36 GMT -5
Not my experience at all. My HOCALJ, the rest of management, and everyone else in the HO are consummate professionals. We collaborate, do our job, and enjoy our work. YMMV. Hey rp, when you applied to be an ALJ how did they view your AFPD experience? I'm also an AFPD, but since law school I've wanted to be an ALJ. I ladder up to the equivalent of GS-15, but no supervision. - I sent you a PM. |
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Post by hamster on Nov 6, 2020 15:34:16 GMT -5
Mr Atkins wrote, “Sure, I have to schedule 50 hearings to keep telework....”
Not right now you don’t. I schedule fewer than 50. TPTB can pound sand. Everybody can telework—unless you’re Management.
I’m retiring next year. Maybe they’ll do some hiring to fill my big shoes. (They are actually minuscule by human standards, but I have big feet for a hamster.) Some new ALJ can have my job. You won’t figure out that my HOCALJ is an ***hole for at least six months. But as they say, YMMV.
Respectfully, Hamster
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Post by Mister Atkins on Nov 6, 2020 17:23:02 GMT -5
Mr Atkins wrote, “Sure, I have to schedule 50 hearings to keep telework....” Not right now you don’t. I schedule fewer than 50. TPTB can pound sand. Everybody can telework—unless you’re Management. I’m retiring next year. Maybe they’ll do some hiring to fill my big shoes. (They are actually minuscule by human standards, but I have big feet for a hamster.) Some new ALJ can have my job. You won’t figure out that my HOCALJ is an ***hole for at least six months. But as they say, YMMV. Respectfully, Hamster This is true, we're all teleworking now, every day. Also true is that although I provide 50 hearing slots, they don't fill them all. I hate that your HOCALJ is an a$$**le, though. One more reason why I'm not very interested in moving. No doubt, the job isn't the plum it once was, but it's a good job, and even if I end up with one of *those* HOCALJs, I have a temperament that allows me to deal with that like water off of a duck's back. Seriously, I don't see how logging in to WebTA is onerous. Not when it's offset by at will credit hours. Miss you too rp |
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Post by Pixie on Nov 20, 2020 11:56:58 GMT -5
I’m not an ALJ, but one thing I’m not liking from what I hear is the micro management. I don’t want to clock in and clock out like a teenager working at Sears. When signing in and out was optional, I only knew one ALJ who opted not to sign in and out. It actually was favorable to us to do so (and still is). When I got this job, I thought I had died and gone to Heaven. No longer did I have to work 9 to 10 hour days when not in trial, but got compensated for any time I worked over 8 hours. That doesn't work if one doesn't sign in and out (and get credit for extra hours). I didn't mind it one bit. Pixie |
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Post by lurkerbelow on Nov 20, 2020 16:47:37 GMT -5
My only problem with WebTA is how long the dang thing takes to update into the "how am I doing" reports. It makes DWPI more irritating than anything.
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Post by numbersix on Nov 21, 2020 6:33:51 GMT -5
Mr Atkins wrote, “Sure, I have to schedule 50 hearings to keep telework....” Not right now you don’t. I schedule fewer than 50. TPTB can pound sand. Everybody can telework—unless you’re Management. I’m retiring next year. Maybe they’ll do some hiring to fill my big shoes. (They are actually minuscule by human standards, but I have big feet for a hamster.) Some new ALJ can have my job. You won’t figure out that my HOCALJ is an ***hole for at least six months. But as they say, YMMV. Respectfully, Hamster This is true, we're all teleworking now, every day. Also true is that although I provide 50 hearing slots, they don't fill them all. I hate that your HOCALJ is an a$$**le, though. One more reason why I'm not very interested in moving. No doubt, the job isn't the plum it once was, but it's a good job, and even if I end up with one of *those* HOCALJs, I have a temperament that allows me to deal with that like water off of a duck's back. Seriously, I don't see how logging in to WebTA is onerous. Not when it's offset by at will credit hours. Miss you too rpDoes anyone have the regulation that states an agency must make you sign in and out like a time card in order to earn credit hours? I think this is an SSA preference not based on law, but if there is authority for it, I would love to know. |
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Post by hopefalj on Nov 21, 2020 12:38:26 GMT -5
I’ve said it 50 times and will probably say it 27 times more... if you have a big hang up or take offense to your professionalism with clocking in and out to document your time, you’re not going to enjoy any aspect of working for SSA as an ALJ or otherwise. In my experience, using WebTA is about 10% as onerous as billing hours was in private practice, and there are dozens of more offensive management practices to offend your professionalism than using a software program to track your daily work hours.
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