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Post by acttwo on Aug 5, 2017 0:27:44 GMT -5
PS: do you think Funky will honor us with an appearance? I was so bummed when he "left"!
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Post by gary on Aug 5, 2017 0:40:29 GMT -5
The last time he dropped in was when SSA hired acemidnight. I don't know that they could do anything to equal that, so I'm guessing not.
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Post by aljwishhope on Aug 5, 2017 6:08:34 GMT -5
All you folks with scores in the low 70s will be really mad when you take yourself out of contention by applying under the refresh exam only to see folks with scores in the 60s hired.
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Post by 71stretch on Aug 5, 2017 7:41:23 GMT -5
All you folks with scores in the low 70s will be really mad when you take yourself out of contention by applying under the refresh exam only to see folks with scores in the 60s hired. If you are already on the register and reapply, you are still on the register and eligible to be hired using your old score (if more than a year has passed since you got it) until your scoring on the new exam is completed. Now, if something weird happens and you don't get past phase 1 the second time, that can happen fast. So, reapplying is a risk. With a score in the 70's, I would not reapply. And I didn't.  |
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Post by Pixie on Aug 5, 2017 8:53:16 GMT -5
You know, I think we need some greendog wisdom to make sense of this. With GreenDog, Gary, Christina, bayou, and the Goddess Pixie, much wisdom can be gleaned . And many other legends and elders. Papa judge, ace midnight and judge ratty are a few examples. A whole new move. Well played, OPM, well played, but it will take more than this to trip us up! How fleeting is Board fame. You didn't even mention the great funkyodar, the man of a thousand sources. She didn't mention him because he is gone and mostly forgotten by most of the newbies from the Class (group) of 2016. Soon we will have a new group of newbies on board, and the cycle will repeat itself. Pixie |
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Post by Ace Midnight on Aug 5, 2017 8:54:15 GMT -5
The last time he dropped in was when SSA hired acemidnight. I don't know that they could do anything to equal that, so I'm guessing not. I know the appointment is the most significant event in my life thus far. I had no idea how far reaching that sentiment was for others. To the core point, though, I would not be worried about this at all, unless I had a quite low score. Even then, if they want you they'll get you in the next 16 to 18 months it will take to get a new batch of folks on the register. That's 4 rounds of hirings, maybe 5. |
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Post by bubbleguppie on Aug 5, 2017 9:10:34 GMT -5
Here is my take on this refresh. I think this was either planned a while ago or is a result of not enough people making the 2016 refresh and its corallary of too many appeals resulting from the 2016 posting. This is somewhat long because it requires a timeline to make sense.
For the purposes of this post, the 2013 applicant pool was divided into 3 groups after the online portion: Group A - the "higher scoring subgroup"; Group B - "the lower scoring subgroup"; and, Group C - "the even lower scoring subgroup".
Immediately after online testing, Group A goes to Washington. Yeah! Group A gets scores in March 2014 (I think that is right). A year or so goes by with multiple certs. At some point, SSA says, "hey OPM we need more people and PRONTO"! OPM says to itself, we can do it faster by bringing Group B to Washington instead of starting from scratch. Congratulations Group B, you are coming to Washington from October to December 2015. Group B gets scores around February 2016 - two years after Group A.
Late March 2016, the JOA is posted again. After the online portion, this group in divided into 2 groups - Group 1 - "the higher scoring subgroup" and Group 2 - "the lower scoring subgroup". These groups are different than then 2013 groups because Group 1 consists of what would have been Groups A and B in 2013. It had to for consistency, and this is supported by the data showing that more people went to Washington in 2016 than in 2013. 2016 group gets NORs in June 2017 - 1 year and 4 months after the 2013 Group B.
So, we think that a LOT of people were cut after Washington this time. After a year of certs, if SSA were to go to OPM and say "We need more people and PRONTO", there is no Group B to bring to Washington for a quicker refresh. They would have to reach down into what would have been Group C in 2013. They can't do that because it would be unfair. Thus, the need to start the entire process up in a shoreter time frame. Whenever the application peroid commences, it will likely be at least a year until that group gets NORs.
This is my long-winded way of saying that the job announcement happening sooner rather than later makes sense if you look at the whole timeline and assume robust hiring. One agency or the other is trying to prevent the blame game on there not being enough names on the register.
I could have some of the dates off a bit and do not have time to check for them but this is what I have been thinking. Please excuse any typos or misspellings. I have a kid and dog jumping on the keyboard!
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Post by acttwo on Aug 5, 2017 9:38:51 GMT -5
How fleeting is Board fame. You didn't even mention the great funkyodar, the man of a thousand sources. She didn't mention him because he is gone and mostly forgotten by most of the newbies from the Class (group) of 2016. Soon we will have a new group of newbies on board, and the cycle will repeat itself. Pixie Actually, I missed A LOT of folks b/c on the tablet, I am not good at multiple windows yet. It is a compliment to ALJD and Pixie that this board is so full of kind, informed and sharing members---there are just too many to recall at 11 pm when dashing out a reply. While here, I will say I got a bit of a fright from Bubbleguppie's post. I am going to hope my deficiency was in the WD itself and I can pull myself up on a second try. And I agree with those who just got on the register, this is NOT the landscape we all assumed they would have. I am rooting for everyone here. When I washed out, I thought of trying again, but remember that one prevailing theory at that time (what, less than 2 months ago? Egad!) was that they wouldn't test again until 2020 or later, which really might not be doable, considering age, need to move on, etc. So, I will hope hard for all on the register now, and send up a silent thanks for another shot so soon. And I will remember to monitor the board everyday--totally missed seeing this on Thursday, yikes! And Ace Midnight, so good to see you! |
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Post by acttwo on Aug 5, 2017 9:40:48 GMT -5
The last time he dropped in was when SSA hired acemidnight. I don't know that they could do anything to equal that, so I'm guessing not. When they hire you and Christina! |
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Post by jamie368 on Aug 5, 2017 11:58:47 GMT -5
I've had a day or two to think about this now, and what I'm distilling from this entirely unexpected development is as follows:
If this even needs saying, I believe that Pixie and others are correct: a bird in hand is worth two in the bush. If it is true that individuals, such as myself, who took the test less than six months ago will be able to reapply, possibly nullifying their original score, most should stand pat. You are one failure to upload a document and kicked out at the application stage; during the at-home online testing, you are one bad day or one computer glitch away from failing to move on, and the Washington stage speaks for itself. I believe that many qualified people get FOADs – I thought for sure I was one of them myself as I left Washington in my car. Anything from the high 60s on up should stick with their original score, as a 68 is, by my math, exactly 68 points higher than someone will score a 92 on the refresh, at least for 15 months or so.
As for this issue about whether you received a score in the last year, it's a little unclear when that year starts running – but my best guess is that since my score and your score came in in June, if the application takes place before June 2018, you can't discard your original score anyway. If you can – see above.
As much as I would like to read the refresh in a positive light, I agree with Bayou and think it has negative ramifications for individuals with scores ranging from low middle to low. I don't think it's terribly positive for anyone with a great score necessarily either. Most positive thing is that it does not have effect on someone with an 88, a good SSA interview, and a fairly open GAL. But that's hardly positive.
But as I said, I left DC thinking I failed, and came out with a score that probably puts me at number 600 out of the estimated 1100 who passed that stage. And that depends on whether one subscribes to the prevailing belief that board members score a bit higher than the test takers as a whole. I happen to subscribe to that opinion. But had I failed, I would be able to take the test again (the same exact test? – the same exact structured questions? – I don't know) within a year of the original run-through, and there's an undeniable advantage in that. Plus the non-test factors – I now know where to stay, this time, I know to leave with plenty of time to spare, and I know where to eat. Those are factors that favor the test taker. So anyway, I got a score in the low 70s, and had I done worse, I may not have gotten a score at all. I'm quite capable of picking up quite a few points, taking the test again so soon. But as I said – I'm equally capable of messing up something simple at some stage – and probably so are many – so stick with your score if it gives you a one in three chance of getting hired at any point in this entire process.
Now I assume we are going to be able to expand our GALs, and I for example have almost 50 cities on my original GAL. That's probably going to become a GAL in the low 50s, if I have the opportunity. But I don't see really see the point of putting down cities where I know I'll be miserable – I have enough Craplandia cities and towns (forumspeak – I like some of these towns) in my original GAL to give me pretty much the chance I will have if I change the GAL to wide-open – and what wide-open adds to my chances is the opportunity to work in a Craplandia located in the wrong time zone and even farther away from my family.
Bottom line: good news, they failed too many people at the DC stage. Bad news: SSA is not entirely happy with the 1100. If SSA thought we would all make excellent judges, there would be enough people in the 1100 to counteract attrition and fuel any growth for several years. Good news for people who failed the DC or other portion of the testing procedures – a chance to fix what you may have done wrong, very soon after you got it wrong. Bad news for people who did not fail, and got a 72 – someone who just failed the SI or WD (I don't think you can fail the logic portion) may now retake the exam and get a 74 – and they may be interviewed and evaluated by OPM before you get an offer.
All in all, not great news for those with NORs. But good luck to the people who get a chance to test again – it’s an ill wind that does not blow some good to someone.
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Post by usmccol on Aug 5, 2017 12:13:17 GMT -5
{{Stroking his chin with Colonel-like intensity and thoughtfulness.}}
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Post by roggenbier on Aug 5, 2017 13:22:36 GMT -5
How fleeting is Board fame. You didn't even mention the great funkyodar, the man of a thousand sources. She didn't mention him because he is gone and mostly forgotten by most of the newbies from the Class (group) of 2016. Soon we will have a new group of newbies on board, and the cycle will repeat itself. Pixie Not forgotten by this man who still ha his name. |
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Post by Judge McJudgeypants on Aug 5, 2017 14:17:51 GMT -5
Just want to clarify my understanding... if we want to stay on the register for a few years (presuming we don't get hired earlier), we do not need to reapply with the new JOA, correct? Once the new testers come onto the registers, we may get buried but we won't get kicked off the register until this one officially expires, yes? Just wanting to make sure I don't have to apply again this next round to stay on the register.
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Post by rhd on Aug 5, 2017 14:38:56 GMT -5
Just want to clarify my understanding... if we want to stay on the register for a few years (presuming we don't get hired earlier), we do not need to reapply with the new JOA, correct? Once the new testers come onto the registers, we may get buried but we won't get kicked off the register until this one officially expires, yes? Just wanting to make sure I don't have to apply again this next round to stay on the register. I think you are YES on both counts.
It makes no sense at all for them to have just tested 2000 people, passing 1000 of us, and then kicking us off the register a few weeks later, or making us do it all over again. Not that everything has to make complete sense, but that would make no sense at all.
I think, too, that if your scenario of having to re-test was true, they would notify us that, although we were just placed on the register, we have to re-apply. Nothing in the announcement says anything like that.
And finally, on the pet peeve tip, all this parsing of secret meaning behind the press release is nuts. It says they are taking applications again. It doesn't, and probably wouldn't ever, announce a "new test." To avoid getting sued, OPM would probably have to end this register and start fresh so all candidates are considered on the same basis, if there is some "new test" being implemented. Those of us who just made the register won't be allowed to re-apply, and those that did not make the register will be allowed to re-apply. Not sure where all the other speculation is coming from.
I for one, am grateful that I will be allowed to open up my limited GAL and get myself into play in the next several certs that will happen long before anyone is added to the register. Remember that they hired just before the current crop was allowed to apply, and they hired while the current crop tested, including shortly before we got our scores. Why would anyone think that a similar pattern won't be followed now? I see a minimum of 4, and possibly more certs before any newcomers do any burying of us.
In the meantime, Craplandia is looking mighty attractive suddenly. Not Fargo, though. Never Fargo.
Howya like them paragraphs?
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Post by rhd on Aug 5, 2017 14:44:22 GMT -5
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Post by Pixie on Aug 5, 2017 15:00:48 GMT -5
Just want to clarify my understanding... if we want to stay on the register for a few years (presuming we don't get hired earlier), we do not need to reapply with the new JOA, correct? Once the new testers come onto the registers, we may get buried but we won't get kicked off the register until this one officially expires, yes? Just wanting to make sure I don't have to apply again this next round to stay on the register. I think you are YES on both counts.
It makes no sense at all for them to have just tested 2000 people, passing 1000 of us, and then kicking us off the register a few weeks later, or making us do it all over again. Not that everything has to make complete sense, but that would make no sense at all.
I think, too, that if your scenario of having to re-test was true, they would notify us that, although we were just placed on the register, we have to re-apply. Nothing in the announcement says anything like that.
And finally, on the pet peeve tip, all this parsing of secret meaning behind the press release is nuts. It says they are taking applications again. It doesn't, and probably wouldn't ever, announce a "new test." To avoid getting sued, OPM would probably have to end this register and start fresh so all candidates are considered on the same basis, if there is some "new test" being implemented. Those of us who just made the register won't be allowed to re-apply, and those that did not make the register will be allowed to re-apply. Not sure where all the other speculation is coming from.
I for one, am grateful that I will be allowed to open up my limited GAL and get myself into play in the next several certs that will happen long before anyone is added to the register. Remember that they hired just before the current crop was allowed to apply, and they hired while the current cropped tested, including shortly before we got our scores. Why would anyone think that a similar pattern won't be followed now? I see a minimum of 4, and possibly more certs before any newcomers do any burying of us.
In the meantime, Craplandia is looking mighty attractive suddenly. Not Fargo, though. Never Fargo.
Howya like them paragraphs?
Beautiful. You get a gold star. I actually read all of your post, and it was an easy read. Pixie |
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Post by rp on Aug 5, 2017 15:07:26 GMT -5
Just want to clarify my understanding... if we want to stay on the register for a few years (presuming we don't get hired earlier), we do not need to reapply with the new JOA, correct? Once the new testers come onto the registers, we may get buried but we won't get kicked off the register until this one officially expires, yes? Just wanting to make sure I don't have to apply again this next round to stay on the register. I think you are YES on both counts.
It makes no sense at all for them to have just tested 2000 people, passing 1000 of us, and then kicking us off the register a few weeks later, or making us do it all over again. Not that everything has to make complete sense, but that would make no sense at all.
I think, too, that if your scenario of having to re-test was true, they would notify us that, although we were just placed on the register, we have to re-apply. Nothing in the announcement says anything like that.
And finally, on the pet peeve tip, all this parsing of secret meaning behind the press release is nuts. It says they are taking applications again. It doesn't, and probably wouldn't ever, announce a "new test." To avoid getting sued, OPM would probably have to end this register and start fresh so all candidates are considered on the same basis, if there is some "new test" being implemented. Those of us who just made the register won't be allowed to re-apply, and those that did not make the register will be allowed to re-apply. Not sure where all the other speculation is coming from.
I for one, am grateful that I will be allowed to open up my limited GAL and get myself into play in the next several certs that will happen long before anyone is added to the register. Remember that they hired just before the current crop was allowed to apply, and they hired while the current cropped tested, including shortly before we got our scores. Why would anyone think that a similar pattern won't be followed now? I see a minimum of 4, and possibly more certs before any newcomers do any burying of us.
In the meantime, Craplandia is looking mighty attractive suddenly. Not Fargo, though. Never Fargo.
Howya like them paragraphs?
-- you are right on the money. |
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Post by goldenretrievermom on Aug 5, 2017 15:43:18 GMT -5
I am really surprised they are going to reopen rather than go to the lower scoring subgroup as they did last time. Of course I was surprised when they cut so many applicants at the DC stage of the examination. Pixie Perhaps this is OPM's way of dealing with all of the appeals. Make as many as possible go away at the time and expense of those who didn't make the register and who want another shot at it. |
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Post by goldenretrievermom on Aug 5, 2017 16:32:46 GMT -5
How fleeting is Board fame. You didn't even mention the great funkyodar, the man of a thousand sources. She didn't mention him because he is gone and mostly forgotten by most of the newbies from the Class (group) of 2016. Soon we will have a new group of newbies on board, and the cycle will repeat itself. Pixie Sorry but not true. When I began reading this board in early 2014, funkyodar was my favorite board member. He may be gone from the board but he won't ever be forgotten by those who followed him. Funny, irreverent, outspoken, takes-no-prisoners, informative. I miss his presence. Best handle ever. Gary had better never sign off. |
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Post by christina on Aug 5, 2017 17:34:52 GMT -5
The last time he dropped in was when SSA hired acemidnight. I don't know that they could do anything to equal that, so I'm guessing not. When they hire you and Christina! nah, Ace is in a class all by himself. Gary may be up there but not me. like pixie said, the board changes... but thank you  |
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