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Post by aljwishhope on Aug 4, 2017 11:00:30 GMT -5
I acknowledge that with a score in the 60s I might be buried.
However who really knows for sure.
Many folks with scores in the 60s have been hired.
I am now in Zen place Thank God where if it happens it happens if notoh well it was not meant to be.
The fat lady has not sang!
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Post by montyburns on Aug 4, 2017 11:02:22 GMT -5
Let's not let this be discouraging! I got my NOR in spring 2016. By the Feb 2017 cert despite a score in the 60s I was on my 2nd cert. The register can dwindle quickly. I have not got hired yet but my GAL is limited. I have after many certs thought all hope was lost. And then another opportunity occurred. If you are on register you got a shot. Be happy. Remember the pool of hires is limited to us. Look forward to refresh for opportunity to change GAL. No offense, but you were in the lower scoring subgroup, so all of the scores for that "mini/kinda refresh" were lower overall than what you would expect from a whole new wave of applicants. That method would be far preferable for potential low scorers than a whole new refresh and a wave of hundreds of over 70 scores coming on to the register.
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Post by montyburns on Aug 4, 2017 11:03:51 GMT -5
I acknowledge that with a score in the 60s I might be buried. However who really knows for sure. Many folks with scores in the 60s have been hired. I am now in Zen place Thank God where if it happens it happens if notoh well it was not meant to be. The fat lady has not sang! Silver lining thought of the day: maybe ODAR is making the ALJ job so unbearable that no one can do it for more than five years - resulting in massive turnover and hiring!
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Post by Pixie on Aug 4, 2017 11:06:57 GMT -5
After reading the press release, I, too, think it is a refresh and not a new exam. I am going to move these posts to the Reopening Existing Register thread. Pixie
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Post by acttwo on Aug 4, 2017 11:08:22 GMT -5
since stevil works for omha, it is possible ohma is letting its judges know about the refresh that includes all of you newbie registrants? does not sound like it from the wording but i like my optimistic outlook. Christina, we LOVE your optimistic outlook!
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Post by aljwishhope on Aug 4, 2017 11:12:29 GMT -5
Let's not let this be discouraging! I got my NOR in spring 2016. By the Feb 2017 cert despite a score in the 60s I was on my 2nd cert. The register can dwindle quickly. I have not got hired yet but my GAL is limited. I have after many certs thought all hope was lost. And then another opportunity occurred. If you are on register you got a shot. Be happy. Remember the pool of hires is limited to us. Look forward to refresh for opportunity to change GAL. No offense, but you were in the lower scoring subgroup, so all of the scores for that "mini/kinda refresh" were lower overall than what you would expect from a whole new wave of applicants. That method would be far preferable for potential low scorers than a whole new refresh and a wave of hundreds of over 70 scores coming on to the register. No offense taken. I am just accepting reality and being hopeful. I do believe a person such as myself has a shot. And I agree shot is not as great as it would be without refresh. But my experience has been getting any federal attorney job has been challenging. For many having not gone to an Ivy League or top 10 law school I would have no shot. Maybe I am optimistic because I got a second chance being in the subgroup. Or maybe I have gone through the full gamet of emotions in this process and have no more to give worrying about it.
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Post by gern on Aug 4, 2017 11:15:44 GMT -5
Another perspective: is there anyone from the 2013 class and second wave that has not yet been interviewed, that is, has never been on a cert? From what I have gleaned from all the tea leaf reading, it is pretty much like a horror movie: "If They want you, They will get you." If you knock the interview out of the park, you will end up on board. If you've had an interview, you're in as far as you need to be. Going further with this: Forget about the NoR number- it tells you when you are going to be interviewed- now, later, much later. The thing that matters is the thing we are not told: Highly Recommend, Recommend, Not Recommended. Get in the first group, get hired. Get in the third, not hired. Get in the second, and you're on roller coaster with a seat as wide as your GAL. This is, of course, WAG and hopeful interpretation, but can anyone point out fallacies in this for me?
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Post by Pixie on Aug 4, 2017 11:49:18 GMT -5
As a 2016'er, I gotta say the timing is . . . almost rude, as our group hasn't even weathered a single cert, yet! It's kinda like being stood up on a blind date! Was it something we said? J I concur with feeling a bit jilted. I interviewed earlier this week. I left the interview feeling foolish, riddled with self-doubt, and perseverating over all of the things that I could have/should have said. On top of everything else, I eliminated several of the cities for which I made cert leaving me with a pretty puny GAL. My take-away is this: if I don't get a call for this cert, and I don't make the next cert for cities listed on my GAL, then I received a "not recommended" and/or was three-struck following my interview. Sound about right? Nope, doesn't sound about right at all. Don't be so pessimistic. For an example, look at Ace Midnight's situation. He was on every cert since about 2009. Wasn't until last year that he was hired. Pixie
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Post by montyburns on Aug 4, 2017 11:57:36 GMT -5
Or maybe I have gone through the full gamet of emotions in this process and have no more to give worrying about it. Whatever happens, I'll be happy to get to that point!
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Post by foghorn on Aug 4, 2017 12:03:12 GMT -5
After reading the press release, I, too, think it is a refresh and not a new exam. I am going to move these posts to the Reopening Existing Register thread. Pixie With all due deference, as I look at the release and it's wording and phrasing, it looks like a new exam:
Statement from the U.S. Office of Personnel Management Regarding the 2017 Administrative Law Judge Examination
Washington DC - The U.S. Office of Personnel Management (OPM) is announcing it will open the Administrative Law Judge (ALJ) Examination to interested applicants in the near future by posting a job opportunity announcement on USAJOBS.
ALJs serve as impartial arbiters at regulatory and benefits-granting agencies. Individuals who are interested in applying are urged to monitor the USAJOBS website in the coming weeks. A notice will also be posted on the OPM ALJ website.
The ALJ examination involves a full review of applicant qualifications, including specific legal experience and bar status, and a multi-part assessment of relevant competencies, through the use of online, proctored and in-person assessments. Applicants who pass the preliminary qualification screening and proceed past an online assessment process will then be scheduled to participate in the proctored and in-person assessments in the Washington, DC, area.
By applying for the ALJ examination, applicants are essentially applying to be placed on a register (i.e., a list of eligibles), not for a specific job at a specific agency. The ALJ register is a list of applicants who are eligible for selection as an entry-level ALJ. It is used to make referrals, based on final scores and location choices, to agencies for employment consideration when they have entry level ALJ vacancies to fill. In order to be placed on the register, an applicant must meet the qualification requirements, successfully complete all components of the ALJ examination and receive a final numerical rating.
- end -
Note it speaks of the 2017 Examination, not the 2016-2017 examination. Then the second paragraph which talks about by doing this you are applying to be placed on the register. It says nothing about "existing applicants who are on the register...." Sure looks like a whole new exam to me.
but what do I know....
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Post by montyburns on Aug 4, 2017 12:04:26 GMT -5
As a 2016'er, I gotta say the timing is . . . almost rude, as our group hasn't even weathered a single cert, yet! It's kinda like being stood up on a blind date! Was it something we said? J I concur with feeling a bit jilted. I interviewed earlier this week. I left the interview feeling foolish, riddled with self-doubt, and perseverating over all of the things that I could have/should have said. On top of everything else, I eliminated several of the cities for which I made cert leaving me with a pretty puny GAL. My take-away is this: if I don't get a call for this cert, and I don't make the next cert for cities listed on my GAL, then I received a "not recommended" and/or was three-struck following my interview. Sound about right? Nope, you already scored high enough to get on cert 1. If you miss out on this cert or the next, it only means that someone else did better on the interview/ did the same had a better score/ they found an insider they wanted to hire anyway/ etc. Way, way too soon to infer anything about being three struck or having failed the interview. You will soon have an opportunity to expand your gal. Thus you will make many more certs if you choose to expand your gal (and maybe if you don't). Impossible to know how the interview went and there nothing to do about it now, so all you can do is let it go.
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Post by odarwinian on Aug 4, 2017 12:07:56 GMT -5
I think we are splitting hairs on the definition of "new exam". It appears OPM will be starting the whole ALJ hiring process from scratch in the near future - that is what some mean by a "new exam" as opposed to calling up those that were initially FOADed after the online assessment. There does not appear to be an entirely new process, though, which is what some of us mean by "new exam". Dig?
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Post by aljalex on Aug 4, 2017 12:15:54 GMT -5
I think it's a refresh in a sense that a new exam will be administered and the new eligibles will be ADDED to the existing register. For me and those similarly situated (with a score in mid 60s and a narrow GAL), realistically speaking, we will get buried by the new add-ons with the scores higher than ours, unless we get on a cert before the new exam is graded. On top of that, assuming that as 2016'ers we can't participate in this upcoming examination, I and those similarly situated appear to be in a worse position than we would have been had we not passed the damned exam!
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Post by defender on Aug 4, 2017 12:20:57 GMT -5
Is a refresh considered allowing more from the online component the chance to go to D.C.? Those of us who did not get to D.C. That would be good for me as I was not in the higher scoring group. However, the way I read it, it is a complete opening for new applicants to start the process.
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Post by rp on Aug 4, 2017 12:21:15 GMT -5
I think it's a refresh in a sense that a new exam will be administered and the new eligibles will be ADDED to the existing register. For me and those similarly situated (with a score in mid 60s and a narrow GAL), realistically speaking, we will get buried by the new add-ons with the scores higher than ours, unless we get on a cert before the new exam is graded. On top of that, assuming that as 2016'ers we can't participate in this upcoming examination, I and those similarly situated appear to be in a worse position than we would have been had we not passed the damned exam!
P.S. Had to edit this post as this is my 66th one on this board. My score was 66.05 and I am haunted by it (my phone is at 66% battery most of the time when I notice it!) Uh -- why can't you reapply to raise your score if you want? NEVERMIND -- gary just answered this below. Sorry.
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Post by gary on Aug 4, 2017 12:22:18 GMT -5
I think we are splitting hairs on the definition of "new exam". It appears OPM will be starting the whole ALJ hiring process from scratch in the near future - that is what some mean by a "new exam" as opposed to calling up those that were initially FOADed after the online assessment. There does not appear to be an entirely new process, though, which is what some of us mean by "new exam". Dig? If they are refreshing the register, new applicants will be accepted and put through the wringer. Those of us they've already wrung will stay on the register and don't have to be rewrung to do so. If it's a new exam, it will be new applicants plus anyone on the register who wants to stay on it. Once the applicants were put through their paces and NORs were out, those who were successful would be placed on a new register. The old register would be terminated and anyone on the old register who did not successfully test for the new register would no longer be eligible to be considered for any ALJ positions. The distinction is thus of great significance.
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Post by rp on Aug 4, 2017 12:23:03 GMT -5
After reading the press release, I, too, think it is a refresh and not a new exam. I am going to move these posts to the Reopening Existing Register thread. Pixie Quote in order to bump this. People -- Please read these threads in their entirety. We are now rehashing that which has already been hashed. The CW is that this is a refresh -- not a new exam.
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Post by foghorn on Aug 4, 2017 12:23:19 GMT -5
Gary--to answer aljalex's query, can 2016'ers now on the register participate if they are willing to drop from the register?
Alex--remember, this is a one year plus ordeal for the rest of us. You won't be "swamped" with the 2017 Exam (assuming it kicks off this year) until, if we pass, we get our NOR's --which judging by what we all just went through is a 15 month process, unless they cut the exam period for the WD/SI/LB
Time enough for you I hope. Given the appeal liklihood on my SI Hail Mary, I'll go with the new process I'm thinking.
Good luck!
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Post by gary on Aug 4, 2017 12:23:46 GMT -5
Is a refresh considered allowing more from the online component the chance to go to D.C.? Those of us who did not get to D.C. That would be good for me as I was not in the higher scoring group. However, the way I read it, it is a complete opening for new applicants to start the process. No. Anybody who did not make it to D.C. Last time would have to start over if it's a refresh.
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Post by gary on Aug 4, 2017 12:26:21 GMT -5
Gary--to answer aljalex's query, can 2016'ers now on the register participate if they are willing to drop from the register? Alex--remember, this is a one year plus ordeal for the rest of us. You won't be "swamped" with the 2017 Exam (assuming it kicks off this year) until, if we pass, we get our NOR's --which judging by what we all just went through is a 15 month process, unless they cut the exam period for the WD/SI/LB Time enough for you I hope. Given the appeal liklihood on my SI Hail Mary, I'll go with the new process I'm thinking. Good luck! If you mean those who just got their scores in 2017, those who got scores will not be able to retake the exam this time out.
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