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Post by operationalj on Jun 22, 2016 22:35:06 GMT -5
FH9, I didn't take anything you wrote personally. Merely debating your position on whether one can, or even more importantly should, "lie" or attempt to devise the desired repsonses. As opposed to simply doing what the instructions say and choosing a response that represents what they would actually do. The try and figure what they want approach is definitely a route to take. Many undoubtedly have and been successful. But, as for first hand evidence, I have only my own experience. I answered with my natural instinct. It worked for me. Thus, I suggest others do the same. But each should go the route they think is best for them. Now, I do wholeheartedly believe this system opm has devised is not the best or even a good way to choose alj, at least odar aljs. Too many that would make great ssa judges get cut. Thankfully, I think odar does a good job of finding good aljs for them from within opm's final product. So, in the end I guess it works. The only victim is the excellent candidate exceptionally qualified for ssa work that gets canned because they don't meet opm's poorly applied litigation mark. As for my contributions to the board...well, for what they are I am glad you found some aid, humor or insight. I joined this board, like you, as a candidate in a system that seemed designed to emotionally and intellectually torture people. I used it to gain what little hard info there was, to benefit from others insight and to find some solace among similarly tortured souls. This really is the only source of any info and about the only place where people really know what you are going thru congregate. I've made real friends with many members. A lot of them have gone on to be aljs in my agency or another. They are now fellow judges and I will continue Friendship with them for my entire career and after. Many have inexplicably, in my mind, been left in the torture chamber. Many that ultimately attain an alj position and were members of this community leave soon after being sworn in. The board doesn't really have much of a use after you get the job. I haven't left. I haven't for three main reasons. First, those real friends of mine that still wait here. I want to see them succeed. I want to help them if any of my limited insight or insider info can accomplish that. I celebrate with them when they finally get the call, like my good friend Gaidin. I curse with them when they don't and hold out hope new certs happen quickly. Another reason is what I found when I joined here. There was a handful of great sitting aljs that stayed active on the board and offered guidance, Intel and just emotional support to we newbie candidates. Of course the great and powerful Pixie and the wonderful @aljd. But also forum legends like @bartelby and decadeALJ, privateattorney (who helped me thru some of the worst of the maze). Too many others to name. I stayed because I felt a desire to give back to the board as they did. I have no doubt I would not be an alj without this board and this board would not exist but for those folks and others that kept it going for almost 9 years now. Finally, I stayed active because this community is really the only place where great debate and discussion about big things like what it really means to be a judge, why due process is important in administrative hearings and the like occur. It helps keep the mind sharp and others perspectives in that sharpened mind. I need that. But...and please don't take this personally firehouse9, I am only using your post as a springboard to this topic because you mentioned my "contributions". I have been thinking about this for a while. I think I am pretty much done. With a handful of exceptions, 71stretch, christina, @sealaw, gary, Ace Midnight, @berk77 and probably a dozen more who I don't know their official username and can't tag, all my original compadres are now judges. Those that aren't yet I think will be in September. And this newbie class....many of you are great. But, some of you are down right exasperating. Some, not all, seem to expect that because it's you the system will now work without a hitch and you are entitled to immediate gratification. Some, not all, ask for advice from those that went before, but if what you get back is not to your liking you chastise the geezers. A few bad apples are really tainting this barrel and have largely zapped any desire I have to offer Intel, advice or assistance. I really like many of you new applicants. But, helping you is such a chore when the real jackholes show up. And, to be honest, I don't know that I have the energy or emotional fortitude to get invested in another group. A group that still has to go thru the cuts, the tons of threads of appalled appellants, the incessant waiting. There's probably around 2500 of you guys doing the online testing this week and next. Maybe more. And over the next year to 2 years maybe 250 of you will ultimately be judges. I just don't think I have the ability to suffer thru a 90% casualty rate with another group. So, without further long-winded adieu, let me get to the point. I will no longer post anything in any thread concerning folks not yet on the register. I won't advise, comment, break tension or pass along any Intel I get. And, after the next hiring round for September, I am finally signing off the board. It's been an amazing trip, a truly great community and I will miss it. Hell, for the last three years it's been my home page on my phone, tablet and computer. It will be strange. But, it's time. Good luck to everyone. I hope you each get the honor of being sworn in to a federal administrative law judge position. It's a humbling experience and the best job in the world. Funkyodar What!? Wait - what happened!? I step away to take the online test and it all goes to hell. I feel like Pixie. Funky - you gotta stay. We can all work this out. Seriously, take a breather and reevaluate in September. Make no promises yet, please. You as well as the other members (you know who you are) are too valuable. However, I know you will do what you need to do, and I will respect your decision.
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Post by 2rvrrun on Jun 22, 2016 22:41:52 GMT -5
Funky, "And, after the next hiring round for September, I am finally signing off the board. It's been an amazing trip, a truly great community and I will miss it. Hell, for the last three years it's been my home page on my phone, tablet and computer. It will be strange. But, it's time."
I will hate to see you go. You have changed my perspective on ODAR so much. You are a creative person who always shares an interesting perspective.
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Post by operationalj on Jun 23, 2016 8:04:47 GMT -5
Folks - I'm going in! Dog has been walked, prayers said and fairy dust sprinkled, good deeds done for good karma, and strong Internet connection. Time to get this done! Good luck to all! The use of fairy dust and recognition of the need for good karma suggest to me that this is a person who understands how the world actually works. That's great! I like to think so! Ha
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Post by hopefulop on Jun 23, 2016 9:30:38 GMT -5
FUNKY: THis is very sad news. I have benefited from and enjoyed reading your posts, as many have. I am sorry that "one bad apple" will spoil this for the rest of us but I understand your frustration. I just regret not having your future insight. Take care
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Post by backtoeden on Jun 23, 2016 10:16:36 GMT -5
Hello All. My trial is over so I'm back online. First, I am a newbie to this revised testing process but not to the board or the application in general. I was on the previous register. I chose to commit myself six years ago to a new position and an opportunity to learn some new things. Thus I stopped pursuing the ALJ position. Now I believe is the right time for me to pursue the position again and I would love to get the job in the future.
I was away from this board for years so many of the current frequent contributors I was not familiar with initially. I have quickly gotten the gist of who the active folks are, and I'm happy to see so many have landed the job.
To everyone else going through the second phase, good luck! To those who have been at this from back during the old register's time, I hope your day is coming soon! And to all those who have taken so much time to contribute your insights, information and support for each group of candidates, much thanks!
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Post by 71stretch on Jun 23, 2016 10:18:50 GMT -5
FH9, I didn't take anything you wrote personally. Merely debating your position on whether one can, or even more importantly should, "lie" or attempt to devise the desired repsonses. As opposed to simply doing what the instructions say and choosing a response that represents what they would actually do. The try and figure what they want approach is definitely a route to take. Many undoubtedly have and been successful. But, as for first hand evidence, I have only my own experience. I answered with my natural instinct. It worked for me. Thus, I suggest others do the same. But each should go the route they think is best for them. Now, I do wholeheartedly believe this system opm has devised is not the best or even a good way to choose alj, at least odar aljs. Too many that would make great ssa judges get cut. Thankfully, I think odar does a good job of finding good aljs for them from within opm's final product. So, in the end I guess it works. The only victim is the excellent candidate exceptionally qualified for ssa work that gets canned because they don't meet opm's poorly applied litigation mark. As for my contributions to the board...well, for what they are I am glad you found some aid, humor or insight. I joined this board, like you, as a candidate in a system that seemed designed to emotionally and intellectually torture people. I used it to gain what little hard info there was, to benefit from others insight and to find some solace among similarly tortured souls. This really is the only source of any info and about the only place where people really know what you are going thru congregate. I've made real friends with many members. A lot of them have gone on to be aljs in my agency or another. They are now fellow judges and I will continue Friendship with them for my entire career and after. Many have inexplicably, in my mind, been left in the torture chamber. Many that ultimately attain an alj position and were members of this community leave soon after being sworn in. The board doesn't really have much of a use after you get the job. I haven't left. I haven't for three main reasons. First, those real friends of mine that still wait here. I want to see them succeed. I want to help them if any of my limited insight or insider info can accomplish that. I celebrate with them when they finally get the call, like my good friend Gaidin. I curse with them when they don't and hold out hope new certs happen quickly. Another reason is what I found when I joined here. There was a handful of great sitting aljs that stayed active on the board and offered guidance, Intel and just emotional support to we newbie candidates. Of course the great and powerful Pixie and the wonderful @aljd. But also forum legends like @bartelby and decadeALJ, privateattorney (who helped me thru some of the worst of the maze). Too many others to name. I stayed because I felt a desire to give back to the board as they did. I have no doubt I would not be an alj without this board and this board would not exist but for those folks and others that kept it going for almost 9 years now. Finally, I stayed active because this community is really the only place where great debate and discussion about big things like what it really means to be a judge, why due process is important in administrative hearings and the like occur. It helps keep the mind sharp and others perspectives in that sharpened mind. I need that. But...and please don't take this personally firehouse9, I am only using your post as a springboard to this topic because you mentioned my "contributions". I have been thinking about this for a while. I think I am pretty much done. With a handful of exceptions, 71stretch, christina, @sealaw, gary, Ace Midnight, @berk77 and probably a dozen more who I don't know their official username and can't tag, all my original compadres are now judges. Those that aren't yet I think will be in September. And this newbie class....many of you are great. But, some of you are down right exasperating. Some, not all, seem to expect that because it's you the system will now work without a hitch and you are entitled to immediate gratification. Some, not all, ask for advice from those that went before, but if what you get back is not to your liking you chastise the geezers. A few bad apples are really tainting this barrel and have largely zapped any desire I have to offer Intel, advice or assistance. I really like many of you new applicants. But, helping you is such a chore when the real jackholes show up. And, to be honest, I don't know that I have the energy or emotional fortitude to get invested in another group. A group that still has to go thru the cuts, the tons of threads of appalled appellants, the incessant waiting. There's probably around 2500 of you guys doing the online testing this week and next. Maybe more. And over the next year to 2 years maybe 250 of you will ultimately be judges. I just don't think I have the ability to suffer thru a 90% casualty rate with another group. So, without further long-winded adieu, let me get to the point. I will no longer post anything in any thread concerning folks not yet on the register. I won't advise, comment, break tension or pass along any Intel I get. And, after the next hiring round for September, I am finally signing off the board. It's been an amazing trip, a truly great community and I will miss it. Hell, for the last three years it's been my home page on my phone, tablet and computer. It will be strange. But, it's time. Good luck to everyone. I hope you each get the honor of being sworn in to a federal administrative law judge position. It's a humbling experience and the best job in the world. Funkyodar Thank you funky. I have often wondered why I am on this Board when the only one who consistently has stayed with me all these years (other than Pixie and ALD of course) has been bartleby--and he has taken a load of crap for just being him. I mean, I don't for the life of me know how our two hall monitors do it. Its bad enough that folks lurk like leeches, then pop up like spring daisies to announce they got the job. The ones who don't want to be bothered to do any research at all are also noteworthy. But I echo funky, its the folks who think we should had them the keys to the City (as if we could) who are truly amazing. It takes real fortitude and when you have to employ same in a courtroom day after day--it can be way too much. And I think (although I don't know) what really gets under funky's collar is that lawyers do tend to act like they know what they are talking about--it is an occupational hazard--but we all know how much of that knowledge we can take to the Bank. Has anyone ever looked at our list of Members? It looks like Arlington National Cemetery. Whole lotta names, very few are familiar. I suppose this, in and of itself, should not be surprising, but IMHO it is noteworthy. I can think of three friends I have made here. One in particular gave me advice that allowed me to become an ALJ. He/she left these pages more than a few years ago. I know I have paid that debt. But of course there are folks like funky and the maybe twos handful like him. We all know who they are. We all agree that they should all be Judges and yet only one handful is. Again, not surprising given the vagaries of this process, but saddening nonetheless. Without funky this Board will not be the same, that is for sure. Let me be the first to say that God knows I will miss him. For not only has he been a totally unselfish fountain of information and advice, but his wisdom delivered with this quirky off-handedness (for want of a better description) had been a big reason I fire up these pages. He makes me think and reflect what it means to be an ALJ. Yeah, a lot of it has to do with the Alice in Wonderland life y'all live in ODAR-Land, but nonetheless there is too much universality in there to pass such posts by. A little like Maureen Dowd, a little like David Brooks and a whole lotta funky. Well put, as always.
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Post by foghorn on Jun 23, 2016 11:12:40 GMT -5
This seems to me to be circumventing the intent of the question, which is to see how well you can compose an answer and write in 35 minutes. If you pull up the question, look at it, go out of the test to think about it, then come back in, I think that may not be ethical. What do others think about this? I agree. There were posts on this back in 2013, and the Schultheis book mentions it as a hack, so if the administrators really thought it was unfair or inappropriate they'd have simply precluded that--once in you finish the question. They didn't in three years, so presumably it's not such a grey area? You get points for being ethically sensitive!(seriously, a valuable asset.
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Post by lawbird on Jun 23, 2016 12:02:42 GMT -5
There were posts on this back in 2013, and the Schultheis book mentions it as a hack, so if the administrators really thought it was unfair or inappropriate they'd have simply precluded that--once in you finish the question. They didn't in three years, so presumably it's not such a grey area? You get points for being ethically sensitive!(seriously, a valuable asset. to foghorn, and the others among the newbies who see this as a clever hack and allowable, let me remind you of a couple of things: it is NOT allowed in the instructions. You are applying to be a JUDGE. And, TPTB do read this board. So go for it if you think you can "get away with it. " If I get flamed for this, or called a geezer again, remember, I've been through this before and I don't need to help you guys. Funky's post has got me in a serious funk about this board.
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Post by hopefulop on Jun 23, 2016 12:08:21 GMT -5
There were posts on this back in 2013, and the Schultheis book mentions it as a hack, so if the administrators really thought it was unfair or inappropriate they'd have simply precluded that--once in you finish the question. They didn't in three years, so presumably it's not such a grey area? You get points for being ethically sensitive!(seriously, a valuable asset. I agree that doing so is inappropriate at best. It is true that OPM could have figured this out and corrected it but on the other hand the instructions are very clear: " do not use any device, trick or..." Also, the instructions state they removed the ability to cut and paste from a prepared document. All of that, coupled with the mere fact that it is timed, certainly makes it clear the intent of the test is to not allow you to think through your response off the clock. We are applying for a position as a Judge -- suppose to have integrity and the utmost honesty. So why can't OPM assume that we will not try to game the system? Personally, I see this as being very close to the line and therefore choose to not do it. Although it is certainly tempting and I am not judging anyone who does. Just my two cents.
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Post by hopefulop on Jun 23, 2016 12:09:40 GMT -5
There were posts on this back in 2013, and the Schultheis book mentions it as a hack, so if the administrators really thought it was unfair or inappropriate they'd have simply precluded that--once in you finish the question. They didn't in three years, so presumably it's not such a grey area? You get points for being ethically sensitive!(seriously, a valuable asset. to foghorn, and the others among the newbies who see this as a clever hack and allowable, let me remind you of a couple of things: it is NOT allowed in the instructions. You are applying to be a JUDGE. And, TPTB do read this board. So go for it if you think you can "get away with it. " If I get flamed for this, or called a geezer again, remember, I've been through this before and I don't need to help you guys. Funky's post has got me in a serious funk about this board. Lawbird: you must have been typing as I was but I wholeheartedly agree!
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Deleted
Deleted Member
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Post by Deleted on Jun 23, 2016 13:28:56 GMT -5
Well....
....that was not fun.
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Post by choler5000 on Jun 23, 2016 15:30:52 GMT -5
Judge Funky
What the hell! I was here with you in 2013 and am so happy for your success. I agree that the vibe and tone around here are different these days, but there are still many appreciative folk on the other ends of these fiber optic cables who come to read the perspectives and sage advise/counsel that you,Pixie and others bring so unselfishly. Don't let the negatives get you down. Just glad you will be along for this portion of the 2016 "ride" and "Cheers" to you!
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Post by seaside on Jun 23, 2016 16:37:46 GMT -5
Fiber optic cables. *chuckle*
[only good-natured ribbing intended] 😉
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Post by chudley on Jun 23, 2016 17:42:37 GMT -5
There were posts on this back in 2013, and the Schultheis book mentions it as a hack, so if the administrators really thought it was unfair or inappropriate they'd have simply precluded that--once in you finish the question. They didn't in three years, so presumably it's not such a grey area? You get points for being ethically sensitive!(seriously, a valuable asset. to foghorn, and the others among the newbies who see this as a clever hack and allowable, let me remind you of a couple of things: it is NOT allowed in the instructions. You are applying to be a JUDGE. And, TPTB do read this board. So go for it if you think you can "get away with it. " If I get flamed for this, or called a geezer again, remember, I've been through this before and I don't need to help you guys. Funky's post has got me in a serious funk about this board. [ I have not read the book you mention. I have been following the board for years. I am not trying to cheat the system. I apparently missed this topic discussion from 13. My question stems from the last sentence in the instructions. 'When you re-enter the Writing Sample, any work you did previously will be gone, and you will have only the time remaining from when you exited the system previously.' OPM says you can.
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Post by foghorn on Jun 23, 2016 19:58:07 GMT -5
We think therefore we are......overthinkers?
Time to take the plunge ........ tonight, craft beer (low alcohol); Saturday: caffeinated; Sunday--caffeine with a barley wine or similar brew.
Misery loves company & I love y'all.
SJT--single judge torture? or simply judging twits? I know, sublime judicial temptation.......
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Post by lawbird on Jun 23, 2016 20:25:59 GMT -5
to foghorn, and the others among the newbies who see this as a clever hack and allowable, let me remind you of a couple of things: it is NOT allowed in the instructions. You are applying to be a JUDGE. And, TPTB do read this board. So go for it if you think you can "get away with it. " If I get flamed for this, or called a geezer again, remember, I've been through this before and I don't need to help you guys. Funky's post has got me in a serious funk about this board. [ I have not read the book you mention. I have been following the board for years. I am not trying to cheat the system. I apparently missed this topic discussion from 13. My question stems from the last sentence in the instructions. 'When you re-enter the Writing Sample, any work you did previously will be gone, and you will have only the time remaining from when you exited the system previously.' OPM says you can. I didn't mention a book. I have not looked for shortcuts. No one has accused anyone of cheating. Let your sense of honesty and fair play be your guide. I'm done with this subject.
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Post by foghorn on Jun 23, 2016 21:17:41 GMT -5
Just did the SJT Think calm thoughts
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Post by futurealj on Jun 23, 2016 21:49:19 GMT -5
Just completed Part 3. There is no turning back now...Now we wait...and pray...second time for me...I feel like there is nothing I would have done differently this time; there is no question that I did my absolute best...can't do anymore than that... Good Luck to everyone who still has to battle...I am sitting on the sidelines now, watching and waiting for the next mission...Let's go!!
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Post by funkyodar on Jun 23, 2016 22:32:04 GMT -5
Counting on you futurealj.
Best wishes to all, but future and I go way back and she is due.
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Post by futurealj on Jun 23, 2016 23:05:05 GMT -5
Counting on you futurealj. Best wishes to all, but future and I go way back and she is due. That means a lot funkyodar! Thank you so much!!
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